Anchors, Chains & Cables World Naval Ships Forums Archive

Naval History by Country :

ROYAL
NAVY

US
NAVY

GERMAN
NAVY

FRENCH
NAVY

*VIEW ALL OF OUR CURRENT ART SPECIAL OFFERS ON ONE PAGE HERE*
NAVAL ART	AVIATION ART	MILITARY ART	SPORT ART

ALWAYS GREAT OFFERS :

20% FURTHER PRICE REDUCTIONS ON HUNDREDS OF LIMITED EDITION ART PRINTS

BUY ONE GET ONE HALF PRICE ON THOUSANDS OF PAINTINGS AND PRINTS

FOR MORE OFFERS SIGN UP TO OUR FREE NEWSLETTER

Anchors, Chains & Cables World Naval Ships Forums Archive

Anchors, Chains & Cables

Posts 1 to 50

Have a look at the attached picture and let me know what you think is going on. When I was in the Andrew I was a seaman but certainly never carried out this drill. All I can suggest is that they are catting the anchor. The other question is, how do they get the boat into that position, is it on a Skyhook? I look forward to your remarks, the ships I served on never had catheads! Bob.
Attachments :

I have no idea what they are doing, though I hope they did (at least the officer who instructed the boat's crew to suspend it in this unorthodox position!). It does look as though there is some sort of excresence that might conceivably be a winch immediately above the centre section of the boat, though how such a device could keep its cargo stable is a mystery. Can you say what vessel this was? Other pictures might at least throw some light on the "winch" if not the purpose of the ship's boat suspended from it.

This is HMS Hogue, armoured cruiser from 1900.

Fascinating, from what I can see there's a bloke in the boat looking into the ship through a side hatch. Is that the chains above the boat? Can't see any ropes or anything holding the boat up. Is it for real?

Ten out of ten Kc here is the picture. Bob.
Attachments :

Wonder if the boat is on a swinging boom? By the way is she The Aboukir?

If you look at a couple of posts above Stan you will see that Kc correctly identified her as the Hogue.

It must have that tot made me miss that?

Looks like,in those days,the white ensign was St George's cross without the union flag in the top left hand corner. Tackline.

Look more closely Tackline old chum.

If we assume the size of a Frigate or Destroyer , can you give me any idea how much Chain would be stored in the chain lockers of a ship this size and what would be the Approx weight of an Naval pattern Anchor, and did this vary depending on what the ships projected location might be please.

Ivor, Most ships of the size you have indicated carry approxmatley 9 or 10 shots in the chain locker. Now each shot of chain is 90 feet in length. As for the Navy Pattern Anchor my guess it's weight is approx 1 ton or there abouts. Regards Charles

[quote=CGRET;54305]Ivor, Most ships of the size you have indicated carry approxmatley 9 or 10 shots in the chain locker. Now each shot of chain is 90 feet in length. As for the Navy Pattern Anchor my guess it's weight is approx 1 ton or there abouts. Regards Charles[/quote] Thank you Charles, Would that be 10 shots Port and Starboard or 10 shots total please? How was the term "shots" arrived at , that's a new one on me.... Regards Ivor

In the Royal Navy it is not called the chain. It is the Cable. And the lengths are in "Cables", if I remember rightly. As a T.A.S. rate, I never worked much on the Foc'sle as Gunners had that part of ship. T.A.S. rates had the Quarterdeck and Radar had the Top part of ship and boats. But I have done one of the worst jobs in the Navy and that is in the cable locker laying down the cable as it is coming in.

[QUOTE=qprdave;54316]In the Royal Navy it is not called the chain. It is the Cable. And the lengths are in "Cables", if I remember rightly. As a T.A.S. rate, I never worked much on the Foc'sle as Gunners had that part of ship. T.A.S. rates had the Quarterdeck and Radar had the Top part of ship and boats. But I have done one of the worst jobs in the Navy and that is in the cable locker laying down the cable as it is coming in.[/QUOTE] And us lads down below kept you supplied with copious amounts of water pressure for the fire hoses you used to clean off the cables/anchor as it came inboard...and happy to do it for out brethren up top....:cool:...not to mention steam for the capstan....

[B]"And us lads down below kept you supplied with copious amounts of water pressure for the fire hoses you used to clean off the cables/anchor as it came inboard...and happy to do it for out brethren up top.......not to mention steam for the capstan...."[/B] It was only provided because there were many stokers down in the messdeck, in civvies and waiting for the pipe that the Liberty boat was alongside (run by dabtoes) to take them ashore and have a pint of their favourite. so no water, no steam. No anchoring. No Liberty Boat. No pint of their favourite!!!!!

[QUOTE=qprdave;54319][B]"And us lads down below kept you supplied with copious amounts of water pressure for the fire hoses you used to clean off the cables/anchor as it came inboard...and happy to do it for out brethren up top.......not to mention steam for the capstan...."[/B] It was only provided because there were many stokers down in the messdeck, in civvies and waiting for the pipe that the Liberty boat was alongside (run by dabtoes) to take them ashore and have a pint of their favourite. so no water, no steam. No anchoring. No Liberty Boat. No pint of their favourite!!!!![/QUOTE] Funny that ... how every ship has to/only can run with teamwork, each team trying to maintain absolute competence at the same time competing against t'other. T'will ever be thus and thank goodness for that. Little h

[QUOTE=qprdave;54319][B]"And us lads down below kept you supplied with copious amounts of water pressure for the fire hoses you used to clean off the cables/anchor as it came inboard...and happy to do it for out brethren up top.......not to mention steam for the capstan...."[/B] It was only provided because there were many stokers down in the messdeck, in civvies and waiting for the pipe that the Liberty boat was alongside (run by dabtoes) to take them ashore and have a pint of their favourite. so no water, no steam. No anchoring. No Liberty Boat. No pint of their favourite!!!!![/QUOTE] Perfect we were not...however, we did have our priorities right.... All of the above has a modicum of truth about it...but we got you there alongside the wall in the first place (particularly on the 'Unwanted' en route Portland), and occasionally, to anchor) where 'homeward bounders' were the rule rather than the exception.... For the uninitiated, homeward bounders were that extra few revs put on by the Engine Room Cheif Tiff over and above that dictated by the OOW....:p

Shots would be Shackles, thats 27.5 metres of cable in new money, most RN ships only have the one Bower anchor nowadays and keep 10 shackles in the cable locker, subject to the ships 'Rigging Warrant'. Regards Charles

[QUOTE=harry.gibbon;54324]Funny that ... how every ship has to/only can run with teamwork, each team trying to maintain absolute competence at the same time competing against t'other. T'will ever be thus and thank goodness for that. Little h[/QUOTE] Amen to that...which is why we all, in our own way, were the 'Special1's'....[IMG]http://i310.photobucket.com/albums/kk431/macadian/tot.gif[/IMG]

We were glad to have you down there when, on completion of excercises on Friday at Portland. and then Full power trial all the way to Portsmouth in time for long weekend end. Or the Condenseritis that the Unwanted suffered from quite often. Nice day alongside Q-1 then early ashore to the pubs outside the Dockyard Gate and then into Weymouth. God. I wish I could go back in time!!!!!!!

[QUOTE=qprdave;54337]We were glad to have you down there when, on completion of excercises on Friday at Portland. and then Full power trial all the way to Portsmouth in time for long weekend end. Or the Condenseritis that the Unwanted suffered from quite often. Nice day alongside Q-1 then early ashore to the pubs outside the Dockyard Gate and then into Weymouth. God. I wish I could go back in time!!!!!!![/QUOTE] Your not alone in that Dave...funny how we all forget the 'green rubs'....:rolleyes:

[B]"Funny that ... how every ship has to/only can run with teamwork, each team trying to maintain absolute competence at the same time competing against t'other. T'will ever be thus and thank goodness for that."[/B] it was the competition and friendly rivalry that made the Royal Navy the best in the world, even if we weren't the biggest!!!!!

[QUOTE=qprdave;54340][B]"Funny that ... how every ship has to/only can run with teamwork, each team trying to maintain absolute competence at the same time competing against t'other. T'will ever be thus and thank goodness for that."[/B] it was the competition and friendly rivalry that made the Royal Navy the best in the world, even if we weren't the biggest!!!!![/QUOTE] It's the 'quality', not the 'quantity'....:cool:

[B]"Shackles, thats 27.5 metres of cable"[/B] Thanks Joseph. I just couldn't remember the name that we called lengths of cable. I remember that you could tell how much was run out by counting the links from the Joining shackle to the painted link

[quote=Joseph;54326]Shots would be Shackles, thats 27.5 metres of cable in new money, most RN ships only have the one Bower anchor nowadays and keep 10 shackles in the cable locker, subject to the ships 'Rigging Warrant'. Regards Charles[/quote] Thanks Charles, 27.5m that is not much chain allowing for laying the cable out is it ? What was the max depth that could be used with a cable of that length please? :confused:

In the RN the anchor cable was measured in cables at 90 foot per cable. The Leander frigates generally had 10 cables on the port anchor and 9 cables on the starboard. In really deep water it was possible to break the cable on one anchor and join it to the other cable. The anchors weighed about 1.5 ton. Though the anchor digs into the seabed it is the weight of cable lying on the seabed which helps keep the ship in position. If memory serves me right the length of cable paid out was 3 times the depth of water. It was easy to work out which number cable was on deck as the links either side of the joining link were painted white, eg 7 cables on deck meant the joining link was white and the 7th link either side was also white.

"27.5m that is not much chain allowing for laying the cable out is it ?" Ivor thats per Shackle and each Frigate/Destroyer had 10 in the cable locker so 275m of cable and a couple of half shakles on the deck. Regards Charles

Buffer, I thought a cable was 606 feet? the equation on the amount of forged steel cable to be veered by shakles is 1.5 x the square root of the depth of water in metres, copper based cable is equal to the square root of the depth of water in metres. Regards Charles

[quote=Buffer;54362]In the RN the anchor cable was measured in cables at 90 foot per cable. The Leander frigates generally had 10 cables on the port anchor and 9 cables on the starboard. In really deep water it was possible to break the cable on one anchor and join it to the other cable. The anchors weighed about 1.5 ton. Though the anchor digs into the seabed it is the weight of cable lying on the seabed which helps keep the ship in position. If memory serves me right the length of cable paid out was 3 times the depth of water. It was easy to work out which number cable was on deck as the links either side of the joining link were painted white, eg 7 cables on deck meant the joining link was white and the 7th link either side was also white.[/quote] Hi there Buffer welcome on board great to hear from you, and thanks for the information.......which is duly noted Regards Ivor

[quote=Joseph;54371]"27.5m that is not much chain allowing for laying the cable out is it ?" Ivor thats per Shackle and each Frigate/Destroyer had 10 in the cable locker so 275m of cable and a couple of half shakles on the deck. Regards Charles[/quote] Thank you for correcting me Charles, I was seeing lots of ships bow down for a minute there out of interest what would be the maximum safe depth that the cable could be deployed. ?....... working on Buffers calculation I make it around 91m

The maximum depth for anchoring depended on the amount of cable that was in the cable locker. Bearing in mind that you needed 3 x the depth of cable as the cable that was laid out on the sea bottom had a great deal to do with holding the ship not just the anchor

[quote=qprdave;54416]The maximum depth for anchoring depended on the amount of cable that was in the cable locker. Bearing in mind that you needed 3 x the depth of cable as the cable that was laid out on the sea bottom had a great deal to do with holding the ship not just the anchor[/quote] Yes I can see that Dave, but I wondered if there were any other overriding factors that came into play in a given situation ...or is it that simple and no other considerations to bring into the equation ...

Wind and tide have also have to be considered. As Quartermaster whilst at anchor we used do our watch on the Bridge. The Navigator would write down bearings from prominent points and we would have to continuously check them. If the bearing moved out of the parameters that the Navvy has given, then we were to call him. I can't remember having to ever call him. He did get up in the middle of the night to check them himself though.

According to the Oxford Companion to Ships and Sea is as follows: Originally, all such cables were of hemp, and in the Royal Navy of Bridport hemp only, and an early definition of a cable, 1740, was a hemp rope of 20 inches in circumference containing 1,943 yarns, although the term was rapidly revised downwards to include any rope of 10 inches or more in circumference for every foot in beam of the ship; thus a ship with a beam of 60 feet had a cable 30 inches in circumference. Such a size cable was that normally supplied to a first rate ship of war. it was tested to a breaking strain of 65 tons and weighed 12 1/2 tons per 100 fathoms. Chain cable first made an apperance in about 1800(*Nelson's attack on the french Invasion vessels anchored in Boulogne in 1801 was frustrated by the use of chain cables by the French ships); in its larger sizes the links are studded across the middle to prevent the kinking. The size of chain cable is measured by the diameter of the links. The lenght of a rope cable is 100 to 115 fathoms, a hawser-laid cable 130 fathoms. Chain cable is measured for lenght in shackles of 12 1/2 fathoms, eight shackles being considered as a cable lenght. Regards Charles

"Chain cable is measured for lenght in shackles of 12 1/2 fathoms, eight shackles being considered as a cable lenght." Thats the Merchant Navy definition not the Royal Naval one, the RN have another fathom per cable which is 606 foot, and a RN shackle is 27.5 metres. Current Admiralty Manual of Seamanship. Regards Charles

On rare occasions, which I have not come across. It may require two anchors to be dropped. I am not sure when it may be required. Possibly very high winds or powerful tides. The cable then has to be checked regularly in case the cable fouls one another. I am guessing now. Where there is an anchorage that is in use often which does have powerful tides or regularly have high wind then buoys are positioned and so anchors are not required. Buoys in some places, such as Malta, are positioned as to be used fore and aft where there is no room to swing at anchor/Buoy.

Help me out here please, can I remember that there was a body on the f'csle with flags, raising one as each cable length was paid out thus notifying the Bridge ??? Can't remember whether it was the Signalman on the f'castle who was one of the special sea dutymen and would be there anyway on entering harbour or anchorage!! or was it a seaman? Little h

Not sure, Harry. In my time it was someone (a seaman) with a "Head & Breast set" Later the Officer of the Foc'sle had a walkie talkie and did it himself, also using his arm to give a visual signal of direction and angle of the cable. i.e up & down. short stay or long stay

Ta Dave some of that I remember especially the head and breast set... (sounds like something we'd look out for down union strasse in Guz don't it) anyway I'll have a mooch around the net and sommat will turn up. By the way:confused: how come the DIVER can't answer this for himself :confused: simply by getin his suit and bottles on and havin a shufty in the oggin under the surface, so we can all be brought up to date;):D Me finks he is an armchair diver... if he'd been associated with the L'Derry Sqdn he'd ave been seen ashore in Muff!!:D Little h

I too remember the cable flags but whether it was a bunting or a cable party dabtoe manning them I can't remember. They sort of disappeared when Stornophones made their appearance I think. best wishes Jan

Hi Charles, Sorry I don't know where my brain went yesterday. It's shackles of cable and they were 90 foot per shackle.

Well done and thank you lads, You never let me down , do you ......thank you for your time and kindness. One other thing , did we ever have an aft anchor to pay out ?

Yes we did, Ivor It is called a Ketch anchor. Not used now. Perhaps on craft that has to beach itself. The Ketch is dropped on the way in or taken out in a boat and dropped then the craft can haul on the cable and the craft is pulled off the beach. I think Sir Galahad and her sisters had an anchor down aft for that reason. I think that I have seen warships with an anchor down aft. Perhaps it was dropped with the Bower anchor so that the ship cannot swing where space is a premium!

Thanks Dave, I thought there might have been , for the very reason you said , but also perhaps in a sea with cross currents perhaps ? Have you seen Jims Pics yet ?

Right Girls time to see what you have learnt on this thread........ And judging by the information I have now verified and read up on this should prove interesting. [B]EXAM TIME .[/B] Points will be awarded on this according to your declared Status on board Dabtoes/ Deckstrollers.......pass mark 100% only accepted as you profess to know everything Stokers / M.E pass mark 100% as we have to double check everything the Dabtoes tell us Commodore's pass mark 100% because I've got the answers Derek 110% .. he has a copy of the same book as me [U][B]Rules of engagement :-[/B][/U] Answers to be posted by beginning of Middle watch tonight 1/how would the captain know what ground holding he was veering his anchor on [1pt] 2/What angle would you set between a pair of anchors veered to ride out a gale and minimise the risk of dragging your anchor's [2pt] 3/How is a permanent mooring set out and how many anchors would be used [2pt] 4/what is a buoy pendent [1pt] 5/ " " " " Ring [1pt] 6/ " " " " Bridle [1pt] 7/ " " " " ring of a buoy [1pt] 8/ " are Ground arms [1pt] 9/With a fair ground holding and a wrought Iron cable how much cable would you veer out [2pt] length times depth of water 10/ ditto with a Forged Steel cable[2pt] ditto 11/what are Fairleads [1pt] 12/ " " clump Catheads [1pt] 13/ " " Scotchman [1pt] 14/ " " Riding Slips [1pt] 15/ " " Blake Slips [1pt] 16/ " " Bonnets [1pt] 17/ " " Bullrings [1pt] 18/ " " Dog Clutch [1pt] 19 What kind of Anchor is a Killick [1pt] 20/What are the largest ships Anchor called [1pt] 21/What is a Stream Anchor [1pt] 22/What is a Kedge anchor [1pt] Ready Steady Go.................And no Cheating :eek: :confused::confused::confused::confused::rolleyes:...............

To assist former Exec Branch members especially here is my contribution by way of a Hint or crib; Commence at Chapter VIII Page 200 B.R. 67(1) MoS VOL.1 1951 Amend No's 1 - 4:D Little h

This is cheating, or keeping abrest of the times. [url]http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=jUdZlpHWShkC&pg=PT34&lpg=PT34&dq=admiralty+seamanship+manual+anchor&source=bl&ots=Jl1gFpUneo&sig=C6h7WjBGHT27aLPXOziO1L51ylY&hl=en&ei=-c8iSsmMMKGrjAeR1qW5Bg&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1[/url] Regards Charles

Ivor, Indeed, nice challenge! The terms used by the RN is different then the USCG. But if no one is brave enough to post there answers then this brave lad across the pond may due so! Regards Charles

Re Kedge Anchors, Intrepid and Fearless used to have one on the stern either side of the dock. I never used them during my time on Intrepid, but was told they would be taken out at an angle by landing craft and dropped in order to keep the stern from swinging around in rough weather whilst operating craft in and out of the dock.

More Posts

Everything we obtain for this site is shown on the site, we do not have any more photos, crew lists or further information on any of the ships.

COPYRIGHT NOTICE. ALL IMAGES DISPLAYED ON THIS WEBSITE ARE PROTECTED BY COPYRIGHT LAW, AND ARE OWNED BY CRANSTON FINE ARTS OR THEIR RESPECTIVE OWNERS. NO REPRODUCTION OR COPYING ALLOWED ON OTHER WEBSITES, BOOKS OR ARTICLES WITHOUT PRIOR AGREEMENT.

Contact Details
Shipping Info
Terms and Conditions
Cookie Policy
Privacy Policy

Sign Up To Our Newsletter!

Stay up to date with all our latest offers, deals and events as well as new releases and exclusive subscriber content!

This website is owned by Cranston Fine Arts. Torwood House, Torwoodhill Road, Rhu, Helensburgh, Scotland, G848LE

Contact: Tel: (+44) (0) 1436 820269. Email: cranstonorders -at- outlook.com

Return to Home Page