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RN Frigates: Destroyer Conversions (Type 15) World Naval Ships Forums Archive

RN Frigates: Destroyer Conversions (Type 15)

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Type 15s Destroyer Conversions, Grenville, Undine and Volage.
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Another Old ships of mine RAPID on a visit to Newcastle
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Thanks for these pictures Dave. I always have regarded these Type 15 frigates as a clever anti-sub conversion of some of the surplus Destroyers the Royal Navy had left over at the end of world War 2. One important improvement buit in to this conversion was in the crew accommodation which as well as being more spacious, provided much better protection against the elements as well as a much better bridge layout. However IMO there was one definite area that really suffered in this conversion - the aesthetics of the ship! In no way could the converted ship be said to be more attractive than the original one - although beauty is very much in the eye of the beholder. To prove my point, I include before and after views of HMS Wakeful. Make up your own mind!
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UNDAUNTED coming in the berth along side ,2 other of her class.
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[QUOTE=CYLLA;8155]UNDAUNTED coming in the berth along side ,2 other of her class.[/QUOTE] Just covering old ground, which I had missed, and came across this pic of my old ship, the Unwanted. The photo illustrates the fact that all of the class had very subtle differences and no two of the class were exactly alike. I presume this pic pre-dates her before the 1960's, as she is not wearing the black band on her funnel, to denote Capt "D" - although, I believe the term means Capt "Destroyers", she was by that time a frigate (so why not Capt "F"?) and was always, to my knowledge referred to as Capt "D". Anyone know why the anomaly?

Has anybody got any good pictures of URCHIN, circa 1962-64? I only have one picture.
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Does anyone know why their was so many different version of the same Type 15, especially around the Bridge area.?

INVINCIBLE, here is one i have of Urchin, other than down loading it, not sure it will be has good as your's. cylla
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There were basically five bridge versions: The original fit (low, curved front with windows on the curved face. The last three RN ships (the so-called frigate bridge, above the original level of the superstructure - to give better all-round visibility - with the twin Bofors mounting ahead of the bridge). Those refitted as training ships (with an extra open bridge above the curved one, for the use of trainees (VENUS, VIGILANT, ROEBUCK and WAKEFUL - and, later, GRENVILLE)). The RAN ships (small box-shaped bridge above the original level of the superstructure). The two RCN ships (large angular bridge above the location of the curved bridge on most of the RN ships). Tim

you beat me to it, re the open bridges for training; note no windscreen either! Urchin also had an open bridge which you can find pics of in other posts of mine. tim

Hi Beer Bosun, Your question hasn't got lost in the ether. After their conversions the Type 15's were now Frigates - The banding remained the same as Destroyers so the Broad Band was "Captain F" i.e Undine was "Capt F6" in 1954/5. Anyone got a decent photo of Undine {F141}, please of course?? Dave H

[QUOTE=CYLLA;118111]INVINCIBLE, here is one i have ,other than down loading it , not sure it will be has good as your,s. cylla[/QUOTE] Commodore Cylla, Very many thanks - it is a certainly a splendid photo, which I would very much like to download but I am not sure it is in a suitable format for downloading. Do you by any chance have an original photo that can be posted in a downloadable format? I am keen on URCHIN as I did my original basic training on her. I did take some 8mm film (not much use nowadays) but sadly no stills.

Hi INVINCIBLE That is the only second piccy i have of URCHIN. The other year i received a disc off a very good mate of mine , who had down loaded a hell of a lot of photos .Some of them i had never ever seen before. I am sorry i carnt bale you out ,with your request. So i will help any one out {if possible}...but i would not know of there format, That,s why when they upload ,never sure how they would turn out. cylla

somewhere i have some excellent pics of urchin, i went to sea in her when my father was capt F17 in 1962-3, i have posted some stories elsewhere if they cd be combined to this thread. i will find the pics and post asap tim

try these Urchin pics for a starter, all from '61-3
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[quote=INVINCIBLE;118098]Has anybody got any good pictures of URCHIN, circa 1962-64? I only have one picture.[/quote] Is this Urchin any good?
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[quote=Dave Hutson;118184]Hi Beer Bosun, Your question hasn't got lost in the ether. After their conversions the Type 15's were now Frigates - The banding remained the same as Destroyers so the Broad Band was "Captain F" i.e Undine was "Capt F6" in 1954/5. Anyone got a decent photo of Undine {F141}, please of course?? Dave H[/quote] Undine any good Dave??
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Thank you Terry - that must be the most used photo of Undine. She was my first ship in 1954. The copy I have is very grainy so with you approval I will download this one for my office wall. They were good looking ships in their time. Dave H

Hi Everyone Great photos - thanks for sharing them. Mel

A few more, Troubridge, Ulster, Undaunted, Verulam, Virago and Wizard . Mel
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Nice on e Mel, May I download Verulam - spent 15 months her when she first became UDE {Underwater Development Establishment} Trials ship at Portland. Nice job. Downside - took part in every Thursday war at FOST [Flag Officer Sea Training] + every ship's shakedown when not running for UDE. Consequently any subsequent ship workups were a doddle. Dave H

I have in my barn painted brow lifebuoy "HMS Urchin Captain F" which i would be very happy to see go to a welcoming home, this dates from 1961-63 when my father was that captain F, in later life it stood on a stand he made himself next the thw swimming pool at his retirement house in Ufford, Woodbridge. Its a bit dusty but still in good condition, it was fortunately never needed, prob would have sunk! I can prob add a nice pic of Urchin to go with it, one too big to scan, if i can find it. tim

[QUOTE=Dave Hutson;118323]Nice on e Mel, May I download Verulam - spent 15 months her when she first became UDE {Underwater Development Establishment} Trials ship at Portland. Nice job. Downside - took part in every Thursday war at FOST [Flag Officer Sea Training] + every ship's shakedown when not running for UDE. Consequently any subsequent ship workups were a doddle. Dave H[/QUOTE] Dave Of course. They're there for anyone to share. Mel

[QUOTE=astraltrader;118262]Is this any good?[/QUOTE] Terry, Very many thanks - great picture - I have managed to download it Cheers

A few different type 15 conversions chosen more or less at random. Wrangler, Whirlwind, Vigilant, Vigilant, Venus, Venus, Ursa, Undine, Ulster, Undine and Volage. ..
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Terry Great pictures. Thanks for sharing them. Mel

Yes, I agree Many thanks for share ! :)

Terry, Great pictures of those frigates, which were state of the art when I joined the RN. An example of ships not being ruined by major change and retaining smart lines. Very many thanks for those pictures!

A pleasure guys glad to help. Here are two others - Relentless and Grenville.
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Thanks for all the pictures, Terry I must admit, I have a bit of a soft spot for the Type 15's. Probably because one of them was my first ship Dave

I seved in two type 15 & can vouch for the fact that they were much superior than their previous life as emergency class destroyers.

Hi Guy, enjoying this thread very much, seems a lot of us old hands were fortunate in that we served in the 15's. My first ship was Ulysses. Derek (Bunts)

I did 'stints' on Relentless and Undaunted and am really enjoying viewing the pics submitted, thanks to all the contributors. I understand that the Grenville was fitted with a periscope in the Ops Room, but do not know if she was the only one so fitted (I think Tim has referred to this feature in a thread previously). Here is a link with one of the type having another unusual addition, a third mast, as fitted on HMS Grenville:- [url]http://www.offshore-radio.de/fleet/grenville.htm[/url] Little h
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Undaunted did have a periscope fitted from near the Captains Seat in the Ops Room. It was taken out shortly before I joined in 1967 Dave

Another one for your delight, Hms Wakeful, this photo one of my originals embossed with the official seal. Certainly looked the part these ships. Regards Alan
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Some great photo's recently posted on this thread. A few I've not seen before. Cheers all.

HMS URSA at speed
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And one of Wakeful entering Pompey.
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They look even better in colour Rik. When you look closely at them all you can see slight variations in all the conversions. To answer an earlier question I do believe we had a periscope on the UNDINE in 54/5. Dave H

Rik Great picture of Wakeful - do you mind if I download it? Mel

[QUOTE=MelQuick;119005]Rik Great picture of Wakeful - do you mind if I download it? Mel[/QUOTE] Help yourself Mel. Thought that this thread could do with a bit of colour :)

Rik Thanks a lot. Mel

Someone, somewhere must have the film of the "great race" between Cavalier and Rocket? Rapid? cant remember over the 60 mile course only won by cavalier when the T15 accidentally lifted a safety; i am reminded of the by the splendid pic of Wakeful with all taps open and everything shaking. tim

Found this Wright & Logan from 1961, you can see that originally Urchin had only the lower enclosed bridge but when she was converted to training duties the upper bridge was added as in this pic. I have a feeling someone already posted this one? I seem to have several of Venus, Virago, Wizard et al but only a few of Urchin, possibly as most were taken from Urchin of the rest of the F17, rather than vice versa.
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[QUOTE=qprdave;118548]Undaunted did have a periscope fitted from near the Captains Seat in the Ops Room. It was taken out shortly before I joined in 1967 Dave[/QUOTE] Grenville still had her periscope fitted in 1970. Mac

[quote=tim lewin;119151]Someone, somewhere must have the film of the "great race" between Cavalier and Rocket? Rapid? cant remember over the 60 mile course only won by cavalier when the T15 accidentally lifted a safety; i am reminded of the by the splendid pic of Wakeful with all taps open and everything shaking. tim[/quote] 6th July 1971 While on Keppel I had the fortune to be a spectator at the race between Rapid and Cavalier in the Firth of Forth. Cavalier won by a head when Rapids safety valve lifted. The speed of both ships was measured at 32 Knots. A mate of mine who was a POME [Mechanical Engineer] on Rapid still reckons that Cavaliers safely valves were screwed down so that she would win. In my opinion as the Cavalier still had a full weapons fit and Rapid was unarmed, she was a lot lighter I think justice was done. I can still remember vividly steaming at 24 knots off May Island when these two old ladies came screaming past as if we were standing still with great bowwaves and huge rooster tails from the stern. A truly magnificent sight.

as it was well advertised and everyone knew it was going to be done there really ought to be some film of it somewhere, we owe it to ourselves to find it!

There used to be a CD put out on Cavalier. It was on that. I once tried to copy it to my PC but it was protected. Wonder if Pathe have it in their archives.

These conversions have always been very interesting to me. Are there any shots of any BEING reconstructed?? DFO ;):D

In 1961 I was at Reserve Fleet, Portsmouth when I received a Draft Chit to join HMS Chaplet, a Ch. class destroyer at Devonport on 25th October. I arrived where Chaplet was berthed only to find out that she was being paid off and the ship's company was being transferred to HMS Virago, a Type 15 frigate being brought out of reserve into commission. As I didn't actually join Virago until 9th November I assume I must have been victualled in Jagoes Mansion for a couple of weeks. Virago was the Senior Officer of the 2nd Division of the 17th Frigate Squadron and her role was sea training for young stokers who were berthed (and spewed up non-stop) right aft and young Cadets and Midshipmen who were berthed (and spewed up) somewhere up forrd. I was berthed in a messdeck forrd of the trainee stokers on the port side sharing with the ship's company stokers on the starboard side. On the subject of speed, Virago was a fast ship. Early in 1962 we were leaving the Pool of London, entirely sated and broke, after a two week visit moored opposite The Tower of London. In the Thames Estuary we received a Mayday. Two Gannet A/S aircraft from HMS Seahawk (RNAS Culdrose) exercising off The Lizard had disappeared from the radar. The two echoes had merged and vanished. We were orered to prceed at all possible speed to the area and search for the missing aircraft and 6 crewmen and cordinate the search by smaller craft. In the Straits of Dover speed was increased until the whole ship was shuddering and shaking and this continued all night until we arrived off The Lizard in the early morning, when Lower Deck was cleared to help look for survivors and/or wreckage. Sadly, we found no survivors. During our overnight dash down the Channel it is reckoned we exceeded 36 knots it was certainly the fastest I have ever travelled in a Pusser's ship. The pilot of one of the Gannets was Lt. Lew Baron and his Observer was Lt. Norman Price. I don't know the name of the rating underneath. In 1963, 18 months later, I married Lt. Price's former girlfriend now a Leading Wren at Collingwood which I had joined in January 1963 for LEMQ Sorry: Jagoes Mansion was Jack Speak for Royal Naval Barracks, Devonport - HMS Drake. 'Clear Lower Deck' was for all ship's company not actually On Watch to muster at an appointed place. Draft Chit = a notice to join one's next ship. To be 'victualled' was to be borne on the ships books for food, pay and most importantly 'grog' or rum. Port = Left side facing the bows or pointy bit, starboard or right side facing the bows. For me Virago was a happy ship although not so for 'Old Ship' Polycell, apparently. We had great runs ashore not only around the UK but Northern Europe as well. One visit was to Rouen, Normandy not far from where I live now!
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