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  #201  
Old 21-08-2009, 18:05
dennis a feary dennis a feary is offline
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Default Re: Royal Navy Buttons

MIKEY, great bunch of buttons you have posted. Here are two of fathers buttons, so they are pre 1940. The red one is of plastic (bakalite ?? or summot such) - with`chain' opposite side of one that you have posted.
The other is brass with, of course, Kings Crown.

Regards Sadsac
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  #202  
Old 22-08-2009, 07:56
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Default Re: Royal Navy Buttons

Thanks Sadsac.
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  #203  
Old 20-09-2009, 10:41
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Default Re: Royal Navy Uniform

Quote:
Originally Posted by oldsalt View Post
I think red for Doctors, Orange for Dentists, salmon pink for Wardmasters, silver grey for Constructers. The thin gold stripe for Warrent Officers went in about 1950.
Way back in June we discussed the colours between officers stripes. By chance I found the RN Electrical Branch website and on it the attached table of all the colours. Rob T
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  #204  
Old 20-09-2009, 11:41
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Default Re: Royal Navy Uniform

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Originally Posted by ivorthediver View Post
Thank you John for your contribution here
Regards Ivor
Charles II the father of the English Navy with a bit of help from Samual Pypes(not sure of spelling ) standardised the uniform. Formally the Captain of the vessel was a member of the aristocracy and was financed by his land owners.Had a slop chest on board with donated clothes for his crew.
Charlie boy brought in a standard uniform. The blue jean collar to protect the jumper from the tar in the pigtail, the gunners silk to keep the sweat out of his eyes. The naval salute was modified to palms hidden to appease the sensitivity of his female companion lest she should see a dirty well worn hand
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  #205  
Old 21-09-2009, 20:24
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Default Re: Royal Navy Uniform

Just a snippet from memory, who remembers being taught how to fold & press a black silk. At Royal Arthur our instructor told us to dampen the silk & press each fold using the backs of two brushes to press the silk, of course it was a three handed job.
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  #206  
Old 22-09-2009, 07:25
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Default Re: Royal Navy Uniform

Ah! Yes I remember it well. Thanks for the memory.

best wishes
Jan
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  #207  
Old 22-09-2009, 08:33
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Default Re: Royal Navy Uniform

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jan Steer View Post
Ah! Yes I remember it well. Thanks for the memory.

best wishes
Jan
We had irons at Raleigh, they obviously thought that we could be trusted not to burn ouselves and we had knives and forks.
I remember after leaving Raleigh how we cut our silks in half so that they lay better and also cut the beckets on the collar. Real Jack me tickler tin we were
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Last edited by Wafu : 22-09-2009 at 08:34. Reason: spelling
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  #208  
Old 22-09-2009, 18:15
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Default Re: Royal Navy Uniform

Why did you cut them in half
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  #209  
Old 22-09-2009, 20:41
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Default Re: Royal Navy Uniform

If you cut the silk in half, it lays flatter on your jacket when it is folded. Old sailors trick.!!!!. But make sure that you cut it lengthways!!!!!!!!!!
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  #210  
Old 23-09-2009, 00:47
doug.birch doug.birch is offline
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Default Re: Royal Navy Uniform

Hi, jonti, good table of branch colours,I dont remember the exact time during my navy days, it was mooted that Tiffies should wear their branch colour on the sleeve. the subject was never brought into use. Regards Doug.Birch
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  #211  
Old 29-09-2009, 12:12
North Shields North Shields is offline
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Default RN Uniform Period Identity

Hello to all

Can anyone identify the period of the RN uniform in this photo please?

Thanks for any help you can give

Regards

North Shields
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  #212  
Old 29-09-2009, 13:46
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Default Re: RN uniform period identity

I would say it is around about the first world war. That is when the lanyard was arranged around the silk instead of beneath it.
He also appears to be a three badge Petty Officer. I can't remember when they changed rigs, only Acting Petty Offcers wore that rig.

Bob.
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  #213  
Old 29-09-2009, 21:44
bouncer bouncer is offline
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Default Re: RN uniform period identity

Nice photo, is there a crown above the anchors, its difficult to make out..
Gary
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  #214  
Old 29-09-2009, 22:13
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Default Re: RN uniform period identity

The crown above the crossed anchors is part of a Petty Officer's badge.Each of the cheverons is for four years good conduct (or sometimes undetected crime) though there was a time I believe a good conduct badge was awarded for three years.Normally a Petty Officer would change out of 'square rig' into his new uniform after a 12 month probationary period as an acting PO.I agree the period appears to be about WW1 or earlier.

Last edited by John O'Callaghan : 29-09-2009 at 22:40.
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  #215  
Old 29-09-2009, 22:49
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Default Re: RN uniform period identity

These probably won't answer your question but they may be of interest. They are Circa 1921. The badge may be the one worn by the PO (Under 4 Years) on the far right on the bottom of the 1st image.

Cheers
Bruce
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File Type: jpg Badges RN 1921 1.jpg (119.4 KB, 84 views)
File Type: jpg Badges RN 1921 2.jpg (127.0 KB, 49 views)
File Type: jpg Badges RN Insignia 1921.jpg (61.3 KB, 54 views)
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  #216  
Old 30-09-2009, 10:59
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Default Re: RN uniform period identity

It looks like a petty officer 2nd class to me. This rank was phased out pre ww1 but petty officers in that rank continued to keep it.

I have taken a look at the badge, there is no crown above the crossed anchors.

Hope this helps

james
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  #217  
Old 30-09-2009, 17:18
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Default Re: RN uniform period identity

CPO's & 1st class PO's started wearing the "fore & aft" rig in 1859. The photo appears to be later than 1859, so, agree he was probably an Acting PO. I don't know when the ratings of 1st, 2nd , 3rd class if there was one,were abandoned.
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  #218  
Old 30-09-2009, 19:05
North Shields North Shields is offline
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Default Re: RN uniform period identity

Thank you Bob, Harry, John, Bruce, Keith and James- this could well be the only known pic of my great grandfather George Lisle Nesbit Clark. The mystery deepens though if pic is indeed as late as WW1 as his RN record shows that he was a cook who deserted in 1900-(ship's log doesn't mention it and I'm told that "RUN" on his record could mean that he went missing to the system). Looks as though he was never caught (although that does look suspiciously like an electric chair he's sitting on!) and may have re-joined at later date; certainly his wife's death cert mentions him being a deck hand on the Norbreck (armed trawler)-am about to request crew agreement from MHA in Newfoundland to help confirm this. This may make any ex Navy among you snigger but, pardon my ignorance, could a cook or deck-hand be a PO of any description? You lot have eagle eyes-I can't even see a badge!!!

Regards

Andrew
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  #219  
Old 30-09-2009, 20:51
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Default Re: RN uniform period identity

As far as I know , all branches in the RN have a promotion structure up to & including commissioned rank.
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  #220  
Old 30-09-2009, 23:07
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Default Re: RN uniform period identity

Hi North Shields.Yes the cooks have their POs just like other Rates.Their role is more supervisory and manegement orientated.But I believe you have to peel a lot of spuds to get there. The term 'Run' is navy speak for deserted. We all have our bad days. Cheers John O'C.
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  #221  
Old 01-10-2009, 07:56
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Default Re: RN uniform period identity

which makes it seem strange that he is wearing good conduct badges, I would have thought if he had deserted at any time he would have had a break in in his good conduct, unless it was very early in his career.
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  #222  
Old 01-10-2009, 08:06
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Default Re: RN uniform period identity

Hello Andrew,

I assume you have acquired your great-grandfather's service record shown in the National Archives catalogue here and it stops where he deserted as a Petty Officer in 1900? If not, what is the latest date of service shown and what was his rank? It would help if you post details here.

As you know from your enquiries on the Great War Forum, HM Trawler NORBRECK (FD 30) was a 201 (GRT) trawler built at Aberdeen and launched in 1905. She was requisitioned by the Admiralty in April 1915 and returned to her owners in 1919. She was also requisitioned in 1939, converted into a minesweeping trawler with a three pounder gun and given the pendant number FY 1669. She was returned to her owners in 1945. (Royal Navy Trawlers Part Two: Requisitioned Trawlers by Gerald Toghill (Maritime Books 2004)).

Do you know whether your great-grandfather served in NORBRECK during the war or in peacetime? If he served during the war, there should be a record of his service, probably in the Reserve forces. If he didn't achieve the rate of Petty Officer in his previous service, he must have achieved it during a later period. Might he have assumed a different name? As has already been suggested on the Great War Forum, I recommend you contact the Fleet Air Arm Museum to see if they have him on record (FLEET AIR ARM MUSEUM RECORDS AND RESEARCH CENTRE).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fleet Air Arm Museum

SERVICE RELATED RECORDS. - The Centre holds a range of material relating to service before and during the First World War. They cover Royal Naval Air Service/Royal Air Force officers, Royal Marines, Royal Navy and Royal Naval Volunteer Reserve (including Royal Naval Division) ratings and some officers.

Recently received are Royal Naval Reserve ratings records dating from 1908 to 1955. For more information, contact the Centre.
Best wishes,

Rob
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  #223  
Old 01-10-2009, 08:44
North Shields North Shields is offline
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Default Re: RN uniform period identity

Thanks Rob, yes I have a copy of his records but it's only one sheet and ends unceromoniously with the entry "RUN". I am paying a gentleman for searches at NA to try and locate him post 1900 in RNR etc;no luck so far. I will certainly check with Fleet Air Arm Museum Records and Research Centre and if I get no joy there, will be requesting crew agreements from MHA in Newfoundland.

Regards

Andrew
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  #224  
Old 01-10-2009, 22:47
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Default Re: RN uniform period identity

Hi North Sheilds. Not wishing to steal any of your thunder but I thought you might like to see a pic of my Great Uncle Alfred. He joined the RN in 1912 and left in 1923. His record shows the word RUN and that date 3.4.14 and I think I've deciphered the fact that he got 42 days detention for it. He managed to carry on throughout WW1 and stayed on for a bit longer. I too, have a copy of his service record and it's fascinating to view. His physical details, on joining, match mine except for our heights, which differed by four inches.
The main reason I'm jumping in on your thread is to ask anyone if they can verify that the stripes he sports on his right arm are length of service stripes.
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  #225  
Old 01-10-2009, 23:20
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Default Re: RN uniform period identity

Bob, I've attached a photo I found on the internet some time ago the family are from my home town of Barnsley.

As you can see the matelot also has stripes on his lower right arm.

These were called 'war chevrons' and issued each year during ww1. So 4 stripes meant 4 years war service, usually noticable also are medal ribbons depicting the 1914-18 war medals.

And visible on your photo is a small medal ribbon.

Hope this helps somewhat.

Regards
Alan
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