View Full Version : HMS Invincible 1977-2011
The Sailor
21-01-2008, 06:39
Four ships from three nations sail together during the NATO exercise Display Determination '91. The ships are, from front to back: the Spanish aircraft carrier Principe-de-Asturias (R-11), the American amphibious assault ship USS Wasp (LHD-1), the American aircraft carrier USS Forrestal (CV-59), and HMS Invincible.
A comparison of carrier sizes of the day.
Below.
British aircraft carrier HMS Invincible (R-05).
Principe-de-Asturias is still the flagship of the Spanish fleet.
USS Wasp (LHD-1) is a U.S. Navy multipurpose amphibious assault ship,
The supercarrier USS Forrestal (CV-59),is now decommissioned.
The Sailor
12-02-2008, 05:17
Invincible was built at Barrow-in-Furness by Vickers Shipbuilding and Engineering. She was laid down in 1973, and launched on 3 May, 1977. The ship commissioned on 11 July, 1980 and joined the older carriers Hermes and Bulwark in service.
Proposed sale and Falklands War
On 25 February, 1982 the Australian government announced that it had agreed to purchase Invincible for £175 million after several months of negotiations. The sale was confirmed by the Ministry of Defence. The ship would have replaced the Royal Australian Navy's HMAS Melbourne. :)
On 2 April, 1982 Argentina invaded the Falkland Islands. On 5 April, 1982 a naval task force headed by Invincible and Hermes left Portsmouth bound for the South Atlantic. On 20 April, 1982 the British War Cabinet ordered the repossession of the Falkland Islands. The UK formally declared an end to hostilities on 20 June, 1982. Also in July 1982 the British Ministry of Defence announced that it had withdrawn its offer to sell Invincible and that it would maintain a three-carrier force.
Although Argentina claims to have damaged this ship during the Falklands War this is officially denied by the British Government :mad:
In December 1983 Australia refused the use of dry dock facilities in Sydney for Invincible when the Royal Navy declined to say whether the ship was carrying nuclear weapons ;)
The carrier's air group comprised nine Harriers and twelve helicopters (usually all Sea Kings, either anti-submarine warfare (ASW) or Airborne Early Warning (AEW) variants). The carriers also provide an operational headquarters for the Royal Navy task force. The runway is 170 m long and includes the characteristic "ski jump" (initially 7° it was later increased to 12°).
herakles
12-02-2008, 06:03
There was a lot of anger when the Oz Govt. changed their minds re buying the carrier. A change of Govt. didn't help either. Just like what's happening now.
Of course the decision to deny her access to our port facilities was strictly a Socialist decision - playing to the grandstand. Just as they doing now. It was a very sad day.
This matter is covered in my thread on HMAS Melbourne.
The Sailor
12-02-2008, 06:10
You are right about the Socialist decision on nuclear weapons Herk, but I thought that Britain withdrew the carrier from sale.
I think we still wanted it.
I have to say that Australia is possibly best served with frigates, destroyers and submarines. Carriers are peacetime ships.
It reminds me of India grandstanding with their new carrier. If they go to war, they would lose it first day. Big target for modern missiles.
tim lewin
12-02-2008, 16:36
speaking of carriers here is a pict of one of the spitfires leaving Wasp in April 1942 to try to prop uo the air defences of Malta; Unfortunately I got the pic as a bitmap and to shrink it down to fit it looks as tho its been boil-washed. Maybe one of you better-equipped chaps can help.
Has anyone looked at the pictures of the former soviet carrier Varyag recently? try www.varyagworld.com , the Chinese bought the unfinished ship from Russia on the pretext of converting it to a floating casino, it looks as though the expression fortunes of war might have different connotations in China tho! The Varyag was named after a heroic light cruiser of the Tsushima era later lost as a derelict of the coast of Scotland. Just google Varyag and you will find this strange tale.
tim
Little known fact that the actor Douglas Fairbanks, Jr served on the "Wasp" as a navigating officer during one of the Malta runs (can't remember which one). Need to re-read his autobiography next time I'm home.
On the subject of new carriers, India also has another fleet carrier planned, so as to have two carrier battle groups by 2012 or therebouts if memory serves. As you say Sailor, potential bullet catchers, but only if whatever is firing the missile is allowed to get in range.
Harley
astraltrader
12-02-2008, 17:11
Tim - being able to change an image from Bitmap to JPEG is one of the most useful things to learn and fortunately one of the easiest. I am obviously not aware of which Browser you use [Windows, etc] but you should be able to follow these instructions and fit to most.
Okay - you are looking at your Bitmap image that you wish to change. At the top of the image [usually top right] - you should be able to select "Open".
Click on that and it should allow you to open image in either Paint or choose another programme. When open you should have various options at the top of the screen. You need to select the one marked "file" [often top left].
Click on it and then select "Save as". This will bring up the "Save as " box which should allow you to scroll down "Save as type" until you see the JPEG option. Click and save...
You should now have stored where ever you keep your images a bitmap and a JPEG version of the image you started with...
If you get any problems doing this - or it doesn`t work for you - let me know via PM and I will come back to you...
I've ordered some 1/6000 naval miinatures and want to paint them. I am historical accuracy maniac, so I want to colour them as close to real life as possible. But my problem is I dont know what the REAL colour of HMS Invincible (R05) and HMS Illustrious! I've found many photos of these floating beatuties but every photo showed different colours
I hopy you will help! May the SEA be with you!
Francis Stanley
03-11-2009, 10:57
Fjodin
The true colour is in fact Grey, (the rust is optional!). The pictures that make her appear to be white are just a trick of the light. The only RN vessels that are/were white (to my limited knowledge) are hospital ships and survey vessels.
medway508
03-11-2009, 20:40
The RN has used the same hull colour since 1978.
British Standard BS381C 676 Light Weatherworks Grey.
Phoenix Paints (the railway mob) do it in various size tinlets.
THANX TO ALL! THANX! I will post a photo of my 1/6000 carrier soon :)
Was wondering if anyone knew what was going to happen to Invincible? to the best of my knowledge she is being kept in reserve until 2010, but then what? will they scrap her or try to sell her? and if the latter, to whom? would the RAN like to finally get their hands on HMAS Australia? ;) i doubt the Indian Navy will want her since Viraat is set to remain in operation until 2020
MelQuick
09-05-2010, 05:35
Hi Andy
I went on a cruise around Portsmouth Harbour late last year (good value at five quid a time).
As we passed Invincible, the commentator on the bridge stated that she was awaiting sale to Australia but I've not heard any confirmation of this.
Mel
chris westwood
09-05-2010, 08:50
Hi Andy
I went on a cruise around Portsmouth Harbour late last year (good value at five quid a time).
As we passed Invincible, the commentator on the bridge stated that she was awaiting sale to Australia but I've not heard any confirmation of this.
Mel
I'd feel a little sceptical about that.
delboy86
09-05-2010, 10:38
Aren't the sea harriers that were paid off a few years back still in storage somewhere? - maybe they would be sold to a potential buyer as well....
Del.
harry.gibbon
09-05-2010, 16:29
Re pic in post #6 wonder why the guy stood on platform just above port anchor is the only crew member not cleaned into whites???
Little h
steve roberts
09-05-2010, 17:06
Hi Little h.Well spotted sir! 10 days #9's at least for that said gentleman.Spoils the whole look of Procedure Alpha.:D
Regards Steve.
TheNavyWouldNotHaveMe
09-05-2010, 18:01
Aren't the sea harriers that were paid off a few years back still in storage somewhere? - maybe they would be sold to a potential buyer as well....
Del.
No - maybe one or two still at Shawbury, but the rest have gone to museums etc.
harry.gibbon
09-05-2010, 18:13
No - maybe one or two still at Shawbury, but the rest have gone to museums etc.
From what I read;
Does that mean that since 2006 the 'Shawbury 11' been dessimated to a couple of airframes? What will have happened to the 9 which went to Culdrose plus there were 2 at Cottesmore.
Little h
TheNavyWouldNotHaveMe
09-05-2010, 18:57
From what I can gather, there's ZH804, ZH811, ZD579.
There were a few moved to SFDO Culdrose in 2007. These are used for ground handling training.
Was wondering if anyone knew what was going to happen to Invincible? to the best of my knowledge she is beig kept in reserve until 2010, but then what? will they scrap her or try to sell her? and if the latter, to whom? would the RAN like to finally get their hands on HMAS Australia? ;) i doubt the Indian Navy will want her since Virrat is set to remain in operation until 2020
India at one time may have been a possibility, but not now. Any other Country with harriers has its own carrier, so no takers there.
I reckon she has sailed her last mile and unless the good folk at Barrow pull off a miracle and bring her home for preservation, then sadly its just one last trip
harry.gibbon
11-05-2010, 23:37
India at one time may have been a possibility, but not now. Any other Country with harriers has its own carrier, so no takers there.
I reckon she has sailed her last mile and unless the good folk at Barrow pull off a miracle and bring her home for preservation, then sadly its just one last trip
Jock3; me thinks that the good folk of Barrow would be better served in continuing to build new vessels for our much depleted Navy and allow this compromise vessel that is the Through Deck Cruiser to lapse into history, albeit when we have the two proper Carriers built.
Little h
ObiWanRussell
12-05-2010, 17:05
From what I can gather, there's ZH804, ZH811, ZD579.
There were a few moved to SFDO Culdrose in 2007. These are used for ground handling training.
There's 8-10 FA2s at Culdrose that are in full working order, used to train the deck crews at 'HMS Siskin' in a realistic manner. Getting them airborne would be more a matter of paperwork than refitting them.;)
astraltrader
12-05-2010, 17:57
God - what a waste!
TheNavyWouldNotHaveMe
12-05-2010, 18:36
They would need at least a second line servicing.
Interesting read here on GIA:
http://www.jap100a-01.mod.uk/Jap(d)/JAP%20100A%2001%20Chap%205.10.htm#_Toc173651763
MelQuick
12-05-2010, 20:25
Hi Everone. I agree - what a waste. I was responsible for some of the trials on Sea Harrier FA2 while I was in the Flt Test Dept at Dunsfold.
With a track-while-scan radar and AMRAAM missiles, the FA2 was a formidable opponent. Replacing them with Harrier 9, a 'bomb truck', was just bloody crazy.
Mel
Phil Reeder
29-09-2010, 09:18
Does anyone know ,whether the Flight-deck vehicles were toned-down like the rest of the ship,during the Falklands conflict?Previously these were painted yellow,it stand to reason that they would not be left that colour.
Also ,were the flight-deck markings given a similar treatment?
Thanks in advance
regards ,Phil
Dreadnought
29-09-2010, 15:19
Hi Phil,
Have moved your Invincible query to this existing thread
Would be greatful if you could use the search facility before posting.
Cheers.
If you need help mastering the search facility, have a look at the guidance here:
http://www.worldnavalships.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7499
Wellbran
29-09-2010, 19:15
Invincible was built at Barrow-in-Furness by Vickers Shipbuilding and Engineering. She was laid down in 1973, and launched on 3 May, 1977. The ship commissioned on 11 July, 1980 and joined the older carriers Hermes and Bulwark in service.
Proposed sale and Falklands War
On 25 February, 1982 the Australian government announced that it had agreed to purchase Invincible for £175 million after several months of negotiations. The sale was confirmed by the Ministry of Defence. The ship would have replaced the Royal Australian Navy's HMAS Melbourne. :)
On 2 April, 1982 Argentina invaded the Falkland Islands. On 5 April, 1982 a naval task force headed by Invincible and Hermes left Portsmouth bound for the South Atlantic. On 20 April, 1982 the British War Cabinet ordered the repossession of the Falkland Islands. The UK formally declared an end to hostilities on 20 June, 1982. Also in July 1982 the British Ministry of Defence announced that it had withdrawn its offer to sell Invincible and that it would maintain a three-carrier force.
Although Argentina claims to have damaged this ship during the Falklands War this is officially denied by the British Government :mad:
In December 1983 Australia refused the use of dry dock facilities in Sydney for Invincible when the Royal Navy declined to say whether the ship was carrying nuclear weapons ;)
The carrier's air group comprised nine Harriers and twelve helicopters (usually all Sea Kings, either anti-submarine warfare (ASW) or Airborne Early Warning (AEW) variants). The carriers also provide an operational headquarters for the Royal Navy task force. The runway is 170 m long and includes the characteristic "ski jump" (initially 7° it was later increased to 12°).
Commodore of the Falklands Task force and Captain of Invincible Admiral Black is my cousin.
INVINCIBLE
30-09-2010, 13:51
Commodore of the Falklands Task force and Captain of Invincible Admiral Black is my cousin.
Very interesting. I understand that Admiral Black ('there and back with JJ Black') is, sadly, not very well at the moment. Perhaps you know more? Was he really the Commodore of the Falklands Task Force? The Naval Historical Branch book of the 'Royal Navy and the Falklands War' only shows him as 'Captain J J Black MBE, RN, Captain of HMS INVINCIBLE'.
Wellbran
01-10-2010, 06:09
I have not spoke to him for some time but He now has a role in the Royal household, but he lived near Southhampton for many years. I was told through my Aunt that he was the commodore as stated in his letters to her at the time, I was younger in those days! so I have heard that by word of mouth only. I have a photo of him sitting at his MOD desk (latterly) and also a big photo of Invinviible coming under the firth of forth bridge that he gave to me. As for his health I do not know, I expect he would not know about my health if he were asked about me either.
INVINCIBLE
01-10-2010, 11:26
I have not spoke to him for some time but He now has a role in the Royal household, but he lived near Southhampton for many years. I was told through my Aunt that he was the commodore as stated in his letters to her at the time, I was younger in those days! so I have heard that by word of mouth only. I have a photo of him sitting at his MOD desk (latterly) and also a big photo of Invinviible coming under the firth of forth bridge that he gave to me. As for his health I do not know, I expect he would not know about my health if he were asked about me either.
Wellbran,
Thank you for that. Yes he used to have a small farm in the area but I don't know if he is still there. I met him on a number of occasions but not whilst I was serving in HMS INVINCIBLE. He was awarded the MBE for, I think, his very brave raid on Indonesian rebels during 'Confrontation' he and Captain Moore RM, led a rescue mission up the river to save hostages in Limbang. In the gun battle five Royal Marines were killed and seven severely wounded but the hostages were liberated.
He was a kidly man and popular whilst Captain of HMS INVINCIBLE. If somebody had done particularly well he would reward them on the spott with a chocolate bar. After the Falklands his men would say 'There & back with JJ Black'. I think he has written a book about his experiences but I have not seen it. If anybody has read it perhaps they could recommend it.
Wellbran
02-10-2010, 16:43
Chocolate bars?....you mean "Nutty" thats what my Dad always called it! As for Admiral Commodore Captain Black...well if you ever see him tell him that He was remembered by his Auntie Joyce (nee Branwell) as she used to look after him at home when he was a small boy. Glad to know he was popular with the men.
INVINCIBLE
02-10-2010, 18:06
Chocolate bars?....you mean "Nutty" thats what my Dad always called it! As for Admiral Commodore Captain Black...well if you ever see him tell him that He was remembered by his Auntie Joyce (nee Branwell) as she used to look after him at home when he was a small boy. Glad to know he was popular with the men.
Wellbran,
Thank you - you are absolutely right I should have said 'nutty' bar (I have been out too long time, that's my excuse). If I see him I will certainly pass on your words and if I hear anything of him here in the Portsmouth area I will let you know.
I read today its now decision time :- For-Sale or Scrap ??? Barrow are making their case to have it there but I don't think it will happen I would like to see it sited in Pompey near the Victory and turned into a floating Fleet Air Arm Museum ??? We would then have two great ships one made of wood and the other made of steel and both with great history.
Scrapping options there are only really three sites (outside of MOD yards) Ghent, Graythorp & Merseyside. There maybe one or two more sites but, I think it will go to one of the three sites mentioned if the decision is to scrap her. There would be public outcry if they do send her and is beached somewhere.
Wellbran
07-10-2010, 11:00
Do you know what, if they sent her here(link below) they would save themselves a whole ton of money...and thats what counts..and you know I would not be surprised if our Gov't were to do just that...as...see the images here...the word slavery springs to mind
My Dads prediction is coming true, he said back in the 60's "One Day we will not have a Navy"
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/in_pictures/3558527.stm
If anyone has the spare cash, Invincible is up for sale .... follow the link and just click the 'add to cart' button ...
http://www.edisposals.com/is-bin/INTERSHOP.enfinity/WFS/Disposals-Public-Site/en_US/-/GBP/ViewStandardCatalog-Browse?CatalogCategoryID=VaLAqBELPagAAAED8GeasfoP
Teuchter
23-11-2010, 08:42
I note on the tender form it has "engines removed"
I wonder why? - to service Ark/Illustrious? or some other reason.
INVINCIBLE
23-11-2010, 12:23
If anyone has the spare cash, Invincible is up for sale .... follow the link and just click the 'add to cart' button ...
http://www.edisposals.com/is-bin/INTERSHOP.enfinity/WFS/Disposals-Public-Site/en_US/-/GBP/ViewStandardCatalog-Browse?CatalogCategoryID=VaLAqBELPagAAAED8GeasfoP
Now that ARK ROYAL is going to be available I wonder if they will market it under 'BOGOF' (buy one get one free).
Shinysheff
23-11-2010, 14:09
Tow her to just off the coast of Somalia, stick international helicopters/gunships on her and use her as a floating airbase to combat the pirates...
Would it be possible to berth her somewhere and open her as a tourist attraction?
I'm just thinking that the Yanks have so many ships preserved as musuem ships and we only seem to have HMS Belfast, Victory and Trincomalee.
Destroyerman
23-11-2010, 15:53
GaryH,
unfortunately there is an extremely complex and costly procedure in bringing a warship to museum status.
Even a project like HMS CAVALIER (the last WWII destroyer) was fraught with financial, siting and logistical problems. She was previously located at three non profitable locations before arriving at her present, relatively safe, dock in Chatham Historic Dockyard.
But for the generous donations from the National Lottery Fund she may not have secured her present role as a fitting tribute to the 164 Allied Destroyers and crews who perished during WWII. Preserved warships need back up roles nowadays and not just nostalgic memories.
ShineySheff's submission that HMS INVINCIBLE be towed offshore to Somalia seems to have some substance to it until we remember the Royal Navy's recent propensity for capitulation on the high seas. One of the crew could have his iPlayer confiscated during a pirate attack ...... :rolleyes:
Would it be possible to berth her somewhere and open her as a tourist attraction?
I'm just thinking that the Yanks have so many ships preserved as musuem ships and we only seem to have HMS Belfast, Victory and Trincomalee.
You forgot the oldest British built warship still to exist, the Trincomalee's sister ship HMS Unicorn in Dundee. http://www.frigateunicorn.org/
jbryce1437
23-11-2010, 18:04
I thought HMS Victory was British built.The Mary Rose also exists and could also fit the description.
http://www.hms-victory.com/index.php?Itemid=104&id=71&option=com_content&task=view
Destroyerman
23-11-2010, 18:11
And just to add to your timely correction Jim, HMS VICTORY is still in Commission in the Royal Navy.;)
Don't forget there is "Warrior" also in Portsmouth.
You'd think the RN would look at least have 1 Invincible class carrier in permanent reserve. One looks back to the Falklands war and the the MOD looking to reactivate HMS Bulwark to give them another carrier but she was in a poor state. The UK was caught short there and had the Argentinians delayed the invasion until the sale of Invincible to Australia, well who know, but surely the outcome would of been much different? Always wondered about that. Surely it was common knowledge that Invincible was being sold. Did the Argies jump the gun?
In flogging off Invincible and Ark Royal, the RN should be saying "Remember the Bulwark" to the pollies.
astraltrader
24-11-2010, 22:38
You'd think the RN would look at least have 1 Invincible class carrier in permanent reserve. One looks back to the Falklands war and the the MOD looking to reactivate HMS Bulwark to give them another carrier but she was in a poor state. The UK was caught short there and had the Argentinians delayed the invasion until the sale of Invincible to Australia, well who know, but surely the outcome would of been much different? Always wondered about that. Surely it was common knowledge that Invincible was being sold. Did the Argies jump the gun?
In flogging off Invincible and Ark Royal, the RN should be saying "Remember the Bulwark" to the pollies.
I am 100% in agreement with you Mark.
While I appreciate the poor state of the economy how much would it have cost to keep the Ark Royal in permanent reserve??
For the relatively small amount involved it should have been done.
I feel sure that there must have been other areas of defence that could and should have been "cut" before this to my way of thinking essential insurance policy was cancelled.
The fact that many others share our point of view does not make me feel any better over this myopic decision....:(
I thought HMS Victory was British built.The Mary Rose also exists and could also fit the description.
http://www.hms-victory.com/index.php?Itemid=104&id=71&option=com_content&task=view
Sorry I missed out one vital word that being "afloat". The curator of HMS Unicorn states she is " the oldest British built warship afloat"
harry.gibbon
24-11-2010, 23:06
Would it be possible to berth her somewhere and open her as a tourist attraction?
Yep Gary, and the publicists/advertisers could offer two for the price of one, since she could be offered up as both a Through Deck Cruiser and a Carrier to the hoards of tourists looking for her engines, pumps etc etc:eek::D
Little h
HMS VICTORY is still in Commission in the Royal Navy
Perhaps the Government plan to send her oversea's to fight any future conflict? :D :D :D
But then again, think how un-cost effective it would be to have to issue each crew member with a Cutlass :rolleyes:
:D
:D
:D
Yep Gary, and the publicists/advertisers could offer two for the price of one, since she could be offered up as both a Through Deck Cruiser and a Carrier to the hoards of tourists looking for her engines, pumps etc etc
They could always install some paper mache engines just for effect ;)
:D
:D
:D
Dave Hutson
25-11-2010, 15:43
Why bother with Victory when we have Warrior already afloat and armed. We jest but it could be soon that she is our most modern warship supported by the Monitor in Drydock.
Dave H
designeraccd
27-11-2010, 09:53
and now this....sad:
Portsmouth to host Ark Royal farewell parade
A farewell parade is to be held in Portsmouth - the home city of axed aircraft carrier Ark Royal - to give the ship and its crew a final send off.
Both the ship and the Harrier jump jets that fly from its deck are being scrapped under budget cuts.
A formation of Harriers made its final journey from the Royal Navy's flagship vessel on Wednesday.
The parade for Ark Royal, which is being taken out of service three years early, will take place on 22 January.
Four GR9 Harriers marked the end of an era when they roared off Ark Royal's deck near North Shields, North Tyneside, as the ship sailed to Germany.
It was the last such flight from a UK aircraft carrier for about 10 years - until replacement carriers are brought into service.
Leader of Liberal Democrat-run Portsmouth City Council, Councillor Gerald Vernon-Jackson, announced there would be a decommissioning parade for residents of the city in Guildhall Square.
"HMS Ark Royal has a very special place in the hearts of the people of Portsmouth," he said.
Ark Royal will head back to its Portsmouth base on 3 December, where it will end its active life 25 years after being built on Tyneside.
The first Ark Royal saw battle in 1588 and smashed the Spanish Armada. The current ship is the fifth vessel to carry the name and saw active service in the Balkans and the second Gulf War.
It will be replaced by the Queen Elizabeth class of aircraft carrier, which will not come into service until the end of the decade.
The Harriers will be decommissioned in 2011.
DFO :(
Neither Invincible or Ark are going to find new homes in another navy. Therefore wondering what chance there is of either avoiding the scrapman by ending their days as either a victim of a Sinkex or perhaps along the lines of HMS Scylla and being being reefed?
Having all the post in this thread, I'm left with a few questions as to the reason for the Invincible having her engines removed.
1. Was or were the main proplusion unit's removed to serve as spares for the Ark Royals refit?
2. The main propulsion plants troublesome?
Any help on these questions?
Regards
Charles
ObiWanRussell
28-11-2010, 12:07
Having all the post in this thread, I'm left with a few questions as to the reason for the Invincible having her engines removed.
1. Was or were the main proplusion unit's removed to serve as spares for the Ark Royals refit?
2. The main propulsion plants troublesome?
Any help on these questions?
Regards
Charles
Nothing wrong with her engines. Gas Turbines are adapted jet engines, in this case the RR Olympus TM3Bs are marine versions of the engines that powered the Vulcan Bomber, Concorde and the TSR2. They weigh just over 3 tonnes each and whilst Steam Turbines of the previous generation of ships were installed before launching and stayed in situ until the ship was scrapped, Gas Turbines are swapped out on a regular basis. Invincible herself changed one of her engines whilst underway to the Falklands in 1982. The same engines are used in the RN by the type 42 DDGs (2 per ship + 2 RR Tynes for cruising) and the Type 22 Batch 1+2 (now withdrawn from service) as well as the Invincibles (4 in each). When Invincible was paid off her engines were returned to the 'pool' of GTs for use in other ships as required. No point letting them rot when we can get our money's worth out of them. If Invincible had been recommissioned, She could have easily been re engined with four identical units drawn from the common pool of Olympus GTs. When Ark Royal was put into reserve in the mid 90s she also had her engines removed for the duration. There were no reported problems installing new ones when she was recommissioned.
Destroyerman
28-11-2010, 14:48
Nothing wrong with her engines. Gas Turbines are adapted jet engines, in this case the RR Olympus TM3Bs are marine versions of the engines that powered the Vulcan Bomber, Concorde and the TSR2. They weigh just over 3 tonnes each and whilst Steam Turbines of the previous generation of ships were installed before launching and stayed in situ until the ship was scrapped, Gas Turbines are swapped out on a regular basis. Invincible herself changed one of her engines whilst underway to the Falklands in 1982. The same engines are used in the RN by the type 42 DDGs (2 per ship + 2 RR Tynes for cruising) and the Type 22 Batch 1+2 (now withdrawn from service) as well as the Invincibles (4 in each). When Invincible was paid off her engines were returned to the 'pool' of GTs for use in other ships as required. No point letting them rot when we can get our money's worth out of them. If Invincible had been recommissioned, She could have easily been re engined with four identical units drawn from the common pool of Olympus GTs. When Ark Royal was put into reserve in the mid 90s she also had her engines removed for the duration. There were no reported problems installing new ones when she was recommissioned.
Excellent post and a comprehensive answer.
Couldn't have put it better myself.:rolleyes:
astraltrader
28-11-2010, 23:23
Neither Invincible or Ark are going to find new homes in another navy. Therefore wondering what chance there is of either avoiding the scrapman by ending their days as either a victim of a Sinkex or perhaps along the lines of HMS Scylla and being being reefed?
Why is it so certain that Ark Royal will not be sold for use by another navy??
I am not saying this will happen just curious as to why you are certain it will not be. :confused:
harry.gibbon
28-11-2010, 23:46
Excellent post and a comprehensive answer.
Couldn't have put it better myself.:rolleyes:
Well yes but...
The Rolls-Royce/Snecma Olympus engines that are fitted to Concorde are a highly developed version of the Bristol-Siddeley Olympus that was fitted to the Vulcan bomber, which generated 11,000Lbs of thrust. Roll-Royce provided the development of the Olympus engines while SNECMA developed the exhaust and reheat system. On the prototypes this powerplant system was upgraded to generate 33,000Lbs of thrust and by the time it was fitted to the production aircraft, 38,050Lbs were available.
extract from http://www.concordesst.com/powerplant.html
I remember well when drafted to duties in Cheltenham, watching the testbed Vulcan flying overhead out of nearby Filton with the test rig Concorde engine 'slung' underneath, complete with the intake rig.
Not quite the same as saying it is the same engine as fitted to Vulcan, Concorde and TSR2 see:-
Rolls Royce Olympus history
The Olympus engine was first developed and produced by Bristol Aero Engines, based in Filton, England. The first use of the Olympus engine was as the powerplant for the Avro Vulcan "V" bomber . The first Olympus powered flight of the Vulcan prototype VX777 took place on 3rd September 1953, using four Olympus 100 engines, each generating 9750lb of thrust.
The initial production version of the Olympus was the Olympus 101, which generated 11,000lb of thrust. By the time Vulcan production ended in 1965, the Olympus 301 engine it was fitted with would generate 22,000lb of thrust, more then double that of the initial version.
Bristol Aero Engines merged with Armstrong Siddeley in 1959 to form Bristol Siddeley. The Olympus 593 project was started in 1964, using the Olympus 320 which had been developed for the cancelled BAC TSR.2 as the basis of the new engine. The development work was split 60-40 between Bristol Siddeley of Britain and SNECMA of France. When Rolls Royce aquired Bristol Siddeley in 1966, it continued as the British partner
extract from http://www.wingweb.co.uk/engines/Olympus593_MK610.html
Little h
Thanks Obi and others for your helpful explantions to my questions!
Regards
Charles
Am I the only one who has noticed the delicious irony of this page (http://www.edisposals.com/is-bin/INTERSHOP.enfinity/WFS/Disposals-Public-Site/en_US/-/GBP/ViewStandardCatalog-Browse;pgid=MieqQ4wkQg8000ArvQ_8K1sp0000U3c0dIoq?C atalogCategoryID=5DjAqBEL9RUAAAEa3nbbFlpZ) on the DSA website?
Do we know anyone who'd like to buy some laser printer toner cartridges? :confused:
INVINCIBLE
07-01-2011, 16:52
I see from the papers today that time is now up for bids for HMS INVINCIBLE. The MoD states that there have been a number of bids but will give no further information because: '...the information is commercially sensitive...'
The speculation is that it is likely to be Leavesley International, which is the leading bidder. Leavesley International being the company which scrapped INTREPID in Liverpool in 2008. Leavesley International were amongst those that visited INVINCIBLE at the end of last year.
This has led to a number of comments in our local paper: "...so did I win? the suspense is killing me...", "...the winning bid was from the Argentine Navy...", "...hopefully the Argies won't spot the homing beacon in the hull for spearfish homing torpedoes..."
INVINCIBLE
08-01-2011, 16:46
The NEWS today is full of the story that a Mr Kin Bong Lam has bid £5m to buy INVINCIBLE. It seems he wants to turn it into a floating school, as an international college and tourist attraction in China. He also plans to turn it into a floating nightclub, but I am not sure what the reaction of the Chinese authorities would be to that idea! He has added that if the MoD will not agree to release INVINCIBLE to leave British waters he would take it to Liverpool and convert it into an English language school. It would prove a very expensive floating English language school and I would not have thought that was a sensible commercial proposition.
We have to wait until next month to hear what the MoD decision is.
astraltrader
08-01-2011, 23:20
I have no comment suitable for posting.
The NEWS today is full of the story that a Mr Kin Bong Lam has bid £5m to buy INVINCIBLE. It seems he wants to turn it into a floating school, as an international college and tourist attraction in China. He also plans to turn it into a floating nightclub, but I am not sure what the reaction of the Chinese authorities would be to that idea! He has added that if the MoD will not agree to release INVINCIBLE to leave British waters he would take it to Liverpool and convert it into an English language school. It would prove a very expensive floating English language school and I would not have thought that was a sensible commercial proposition.
We have to wait until next month to hear what the MoD decision is.
No doubt its a cover by the Chinese to get yet another carrier to examine in the same way they purchased the Minsk, Kiev, Melbourne and Vayrag.
sooner or later they're going to have to just go build one for themselves
ObiWanRussell
08-02-2011, 22:24
Just been announced: HMS invincible has been sold for scrap to a Turkish Shipbreaker. Sad News::(
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-12396523
James Daly
21-03-2011, 09:55
QHM Portsmouth's Movements sheet for today shows that Invincible is being towed from 1BIII into C Lock. First steps of the journey to the breakers yard to make room for Ark Royal?
http://www.qhmportsmouth.com/port-movements?shipaction=show&date=2011-03-19&days=3
James, welcome, glad to see you here,
Fair winds, calm waters ..............
Edna
James Daly
21-03-2011, 11:06
James, welcome, glad to see you here,
Fair winds, calm waters ..............
Edna
Hi Edna, thanks for directing me here!
James Daly
21-03-2011, 11:09
QHM Portsmouth's Movements sheet for today shows that Invincible is being towed from 1BIII into C Lock. First steps of the journey to the breakers yard to make room for Ark Royal?
http://www.qhmportsmouth.com/port-movements?shipaction=show&date=2011-03-19&days=3
And tomorrow she's going from C Lock to Middle Slip Jetty, definitely looks like they're getting her ready to be towed away :(
http://www.qhmportsmouth.com/port-movements?shipaction=show&date=2011-03-22&days=1
And tomorrow she's going from C Lock to Middle Slip Jetty, definitely looks like they're getting her ready to be towed away :(
http://www.qhmportsmouth.com/port-movements?shipaction=show&date=2011-03-22&days=1
Her final journey begins at 0800 approx on Thursday 24th March (weather permitting) when she will be towed out of Portsmouth to the breakers yard in Turkey.:(
James Daly
21-03-2011, 15:31
Her final journey begins at 0800 approx on Thursday 24th March (weather permitting) when she will be towed out of Portsmouth to the breakers yard in Turkey.:(
Thanks for that, hopefully I'll be able to get down to watch. Working 10 minutes from the Round Tower does have its advantages.
I hope something is made of her departure, amongst all the politicians scrabbling for brownie points over the demise of Ark Royal (which there has been a bit of locally in Portsmouth) we shouldn't forget Invincible's service either. It would be very sad if she disappeared without a murmur.
astraltrader
21-03-2011, 17:14
In case anybody missed it I posted a farewell in the Carriers thread to Invincible, along with a couple of good photographs in her prime....
http://www.worldnavalships.com/forums/showpost.php?p=157060&postcount=483
.
INVINCIBLE
24-03-2011, 18:16
Thanks for that, hopefully I'll be able to get down to watch. Working 10 minutes from the Round Tower does have its advantages.
I hope something is made of her departure, amongst all the politicians scrabbling for brownie points over the demise of Ark Royal (which there has been a bit of locally in Portsmouth) we shouldn't forget Invincible's service either. It would be very sad if she disappeared without a murmur.
Did you manage to get any pictures? There did not seem to be that many people on the Round Tower. I watched it on the news. My old ship gone!! - sad day.
James Daly
24-03-2011, 18:24
Did you manage to get any pictures? There did not seem to be that many people on the Round Tower. I watched it on the news. My old ship gone!! - sad day.
I did indeed! I'll post them up as soon as I get enough time. It was quite a moving experience. As somebody mentioned, 29 years ago she left Portsmouth on another spring day, only under very different circumstances.
I live near Aberystwyth. We are 2 hours from the nearest main line railway. 2 and half to 3 hours from the nearest motorway. Even in Scotland they have air links from remote places. I have often thought how good it would be to have a defunct helicopter carrier anchored in Cardigan Bay near here. It would solve much our transport problems. We could get to Birmingham International, or Cardiff or Liverpool airports a lot quicker.
It could even be a tourist attraction in itself - offshore and duty-free.
Just wistful thinking.
Nobby_N
INVINCIBLE
24-03-2011, 19:39
I live near Aberystwyth. We are 2 hours from the nearest main line railway. 2 and half to 3 hours from the nearest motorway. Even in Scotland they have air links from remote places. I have often thought how good it would be to have a defunct helicopter carrier anchored in Cardigan Bay near here. It would solve much our transport problems. We could get to Birmingham International, or Cardiff or Liverpool airports a lot quicker.
It could even be a tourist attraction in itself - offshore and duty-free.
Just wistful thinking.
Nobby_N
Too late now Nobby - alas !!!
James - much look forward to seeing your pictures of my old ship.
Of course everything is a tourist attraction these days, from coal mines to steel mills, to RN ships and dockyards. I took my sons around HMS Belfast some years ago. It was interesting enough, but I found it depressing. Too much in her was familiar to me from other ships, although I never served in her, a mate of mine did and I have his cap-tally.
You look and think - my past life - it's a museum for people to gawp at who haven't got a clue what it was really like. When we crossed the brow to go on board I was of course in civvies but I felt I had to eyes right to the quarter deck.
Silly old fool!
Nobby_N
Nobby........In a way know what you mean.
Visiting BELFAST was a bit like viewing a body in a coffin inasmuch as the vital spark that made that body the person they were, is missing. Likewise BELFAST - a "dead ship", none of the smells, sounds, vibrations, etc, that any ship in commission gave off. All very sad and rather depressing.
At least when I visited her, I became usefully employed and my wife patiently waited whilst I explained to some visitors up on the GDP what the "GDO Visual's" sight did!
Like you I didn't serve in that ship, but I did serve in one similar.....CEYLON.......in fact BELFAST relieved us in 1959!
tim lewin
25-03-2011, 04:42
just heard on the radio 4 news that the old girl is now under tow and leaving pompey.
Dead ship/live ship, as a child i often visited a lot of RN ships, and felt this sensation, to me it was the boilers that gave the ships their life. Shore-power was like life support, steam on meant the ship was alive from keel to truck, you could feel it through your feet. What to each of the rest of you represented the "vital spark"??
tim
James Daly
25-03-2011, 08:44
Too late now Nobby - alas !!!
James - much look forward to seeing your pictures of my old ship.
I got plently, problem is I've got some memory card issues. Should get them posted up over the weekend hopefully.
James - glad to see you on this forum (as well as WW2); look forward to the piccies!
Edna
You can follow the progress of the voyage on marinetrafic.com.The tug is named Sirocco.At 1520 she is south of Falmouth but on the French side of the channel north west of Saint-Pol-de Leon
Why is it so certain that Ark Royal will not be sold for use by another navy??
I am not saying this will happen just curious as to why you are certain it will not be. :confused:
I felt and still do that any navy that had a genuine need for a carrier or LPH in the short term already had what they required. That along with the fact the only fixed wing aircraft that could be operated was the harrier the options of a sale were further limited
If no one has already seen it then after Invincible lingered for more than 5 years following her final decomm the MOD have already put HMS Ark Royal up for disposal by tender. LINK
Unlike Invincible they certainly aren't wasting time getting rid of Ark. I presumed she would stay around as a source of spares until Lusty finally decomm'd
astraltrader
25-03-2011, 16:27
I got plently, problem is I've got some memory card issues. Should get them posted up over the weekend hopefully.
James please see my PM to you. :)
tonclass
25-03-2011, 16:30
Bye bye 'Vinny'....
Old Salt
25-03-2011, 17:06
This is the old lady leaving Portsmouth for the very last time.
< http://www.bbc.co.uk/go/em/fr/-/news/uk-england-12852762 >
A sad day for many ex-matelots.
Brian
ObiWanRussell
26-03-2011, 07:50
A few pics of the departure:
Dave Hutson
26-03-2011, 08:46
This is the old lady leaving Portsmouth for the very last time.
< http://www.bbc.co.uk/go/em/fr/-/news/uk-england-12852762 >
A sad day for many ex-matelots.
Brian
Brian, I think the final blow is that she goes to a breaker's yard in Turkey - what a sad reflection that we can't even break up our own.
Dave H
Brian, I think the final blow is that she goes to a breaker's yard in Turkey - what a sad reflection that we can't even break up our own.
Dave H
Evidently she would have just fitted in the same Liverpool dock HMS Intrepid met her end.
Brian, I think the final blow is that she goes to a breaker's yard in Turkey - what a sad reflection that we can't even break up our own.
Dave H
There are two sites in the UK capable to scrap the Invincible, Merseyside & Teesside. But the government has sent her to be scrapped on a beach in Turkey.
So much for the governement a few years ago saying they would recycle their ships in an environmentally sound manner. But what happens, the past few years the government sends their ships to be scrapped on a Turkish beach, even when the option of scrapping them in dry dock was available in the UK.
There are two sites in the UK capable to scrap the Invincible, Merseyside & Teesside. But the government has sent her to be scrapped on a beach in Turkey.
So much for the governement a few years ago saying they would recycle their ships in an environmentally sound manner. But what happens, the past few years the government sends their ships to be scrapped on a Turkish beach, even when the option of scrapping them in dry dock was available in the UK.
While I'd probably agree with the general notion that it'd be preferable for British workers to dismantle the ships, it practically possible, your post contains a howling incorrect assumption that doesn't do you any credit.
This is the implication that being "scrapped on a beach in Turkey" is not "environmentally sound". In fact, the yard she has gone to is fully accredited to international recycling and environmental standards and, in the case of the Type 42's that went the same way, MoD/DLO insisted on any bidders being compliant, and ran a pretty stringent oversight process to ensure that everything that should have been done, was done.
In fact if you look on the DSA website there's a powerpoint outlining the previous Type 42 disposal process (http://www2.edisposals.com/docs/type42_recycling.ppt) that outlines just how environmentally friendly the process was.
The bottom line is that in disposing of these ships, the DLO has an obligation to get the best deal possible for the MoD. Invincible almost certainly would have been scrapped by a UK yard had such a concern put in a compliant, cost-competitive bid. The fact that she's going to Leyal suggests nothing more or less than that the Turks were keener on the work.
Mixed feelings about posting this, but, an image of Invincible at her final berth here:
INVINCIBLE
28-05-2011, 12:24
Mixed feelings about posting this, but, an image of Invincible at her final berth here:
It gets worse - here is the latest !!
Batstiger
15-06-2011, 13:47
Need I say any more!
Bob.
MelQuick
15-06-2011, 14:07
Hi Bob
A sad sight. Symptomatic of modern Britain - the whole country seems to be heading for scrap.
Mel
John Odom
15-06-2011, 14:46
Sad indeed. Even the wrecking machines are made in Korea!
Destroyerman
15-06-2011, 15:08
Even sadder is the fact that I left a flat jar full of 20p coins on top of one of those fan trunkings .................:rolleyes::o
Just kidding, but it raises the question; what little treasures do they find when stripping a vessel like that?:rolleyes::cool:
Sandy.
I feel despondant, since I became a matelot the fleet has almost disappeared. The crowded barracks are now empty, I expect Drake will be axed soon, 30,000 RN personnel would'nt fill a decent football stadium. I keep writing to my MP about the way we are going, I get platitudes & my questions are rarely answered, they treat us like idiots. In my lifetime we have gone from the largest empire ever known to an insignificent little island off the coast of France.
Dave Hutson
15-06-2011, 17:52
Need I say any more!
Bob.
We say it best when we say nothing at all Bob.
If we reflect sadness, displeasure, anger, etc at what our Politicos are doing what must the guys feel who built these magnificent ships of ours only to see so Master of the Figures disgard them like unwanted toys.
I have just looked at Cylla's offering on Gibraltar - one minehunter on it's way to frighten Gaddaffi - the mind switches to underdrive.
Dave H
Hi Dave ,
Yep it was a bit sad ,what i posted on the Gibraltar thread ....
It looks like H.M.S Richmond has slipped under the radar , and is in the far flung,....by heck getting a draft /cruise around there was second nature for all of us old farts.
cylla
Bob that is such a sad sight to see.. brings tears to my eyes.. I am truly lost for words....:(:(
Dave Hutson
16-06-2011, 17:17
Hi Dave ,
Yep it was a bit sad ,what i posted on the Gibraltar thread ....
It looks like H.M.S Richmond has slipped under the radar , and is in the far flung,....by heck getting a draft /cruise around there was second nature for all of us old farts.
cylla
Too true Cylla,
Every time I see a posting of yours I see the Scylla sinking beneath the waves off Whitsand Bay ....... that was sad day but she didn't go quietly as expected. But at least she didn't go for razor blades and is performing, we hope, a good training ground for divers.
Again you have it in one, all we thought about was, what ship, what squadron and where are we going to spend the next 18 months plus.?
Dave H
Lachlan of Queensland
17-06-2011, 09:44
it is really sad to see the mother country crumble from her once imperial might.... soon the RAN will out number and out gun the RN :p
Painful reading...
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/8577173/Sad-end-for-the-pride-of-the-Royal-Navy-HMS-Invincible.html
In the days before centralised drafting we used to muster every morning outside our messes in Drake, names would be called to report to the drafting office where we would be despatched to the four corners of the world. The numbers of men falling in each morning must have been in the hundreds, at stand easy there would be long queues outside the NAAFI, the barrack cinema would be full each evening. Now with 30,000 only in the RN , we will never turn the clock back. The priorities for government spending have changed they think our money to be better spent on foreign countries most of whom couldn't get rid of us fast enough when they were in the Empire. I am afraid there are times when I feel like an alien in my own country. We seem incapable of breaking up our own ships, Invincible being broken up in India.
Dave Hutson
17-06-2011, 16:54
Keith,
You know, I know, living as we do in Plymouth see it all going down the tube on a daily basis. The local "Herald" carries stories every night of doom and gloom for this once great Naval Port - if you ain't on the Welfare Gravy Train you have missed the boat. And if you missed that one, don't worry, what is left will be given to some Foreign Govt, who probably like ours, doesn't give a toss about their people anyway. India probably needs the money from the Invincible to finance their next space probe or Nuke.
Are we or are we not a sad second rate nation pretending we are still a world player.
Only MHO before tot time.
Dave H
Yesterday I saw one matelot walking out of Morrisons wearing No 8s without a cap, very smart he looked (I don't think)
astraltrader
17-06-2011, 21:24
Keith,
You know, I know, living as we do in Plymouth see it all going down the tube on a daily basis. The local "Herald" carries stories every night of doom and gloom for this once great Naval Port - if you ain't on the Welfare Gravy Train you have missed the boat. And if you missed that one, don't worry, what is left will be given to some Foreign Govt, who probably like ours, doesn't give a toss about their people anyway. India probably needs the money from the Invincible to finance their next space probe or Nuke.
Are we or are we not a sad second rate nation pretending we are still a world player.
Only MHO before tot time.
Dave H
Dave - I too greatly fear for the future of Devonport which is still the largest Naval Base in Western Europe with unrivalled facilities.
It would be the envy of any other country with a navy except for ours!
Once it has closed and the demolition teams start their work despite what future may lie ahead it will be gone for ever.
If there is really a serious danger of Scotland following a road to independence then surely we should think very seriously about closing Rosyth and Faslane instead??
I am sorry I have no wish to see the break up of the Union but the Scots who wish for full independence cannot expect to have it both ways.
Whatever happens we should keep Devonport open. :(
harry.gibbon
17-06-2011, 22:21
If there is really a serious danger of Scotland following a road to independence then surely we should think very seriously about closing Rosyth and Faslane instead??
Which 'we' would that be Terry? the UK government with MP's from throught the Union?
The two bases mentioned, located outside England, belong to the UK population as a whole, not the Scots or the English, and since there is no English parliament in existence to make such a decision it would be a decision to be made by the MP's from throughout the UK sitting in London.
In my opinion it would be a most regretable situation if those north of the border were to achieve independance.
Little h
kronserg
18-06-2011, 03:11
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2003673/HMS-Invincible-goes-knackers-yard-No-wonder-topple-Gaddafi.html
MelQuick
18-06-2011, 06:16
Ref the Daily Mail news article, there's an error in the caption to the final picture. She's going into Portsmouth, not Plymouth.
Mel
astraltrader
18-06-2011, 16:21
Harry I too have already expressed a great wish for the Union to be left intact.
I was just pointing out the very real danger of Scotland moving along the road to full independence as indicated recently by Alex Salmond and an additional reason perhaps for retaining Devonport should this happen.
There are surely enough other reasons to retain a base of the calibre of Devonport??
cameraman
19-06-2011, 15:13
What a sad end to a great ship. Lost for words :(
culverin
22-06-2011, 19:02
I do not inderstand all the sentiment bit.
History.
End.
I do however like Destroyermans piece about his lost jar of 20p.
Think you have the wrong Invincible, your 2/6d farthing went to the bottom at Jutland.
And you had saved so diligently all that time.
Why is it so certain that Ark Royal will not be sold for use by another navy??
I am not saying this will happen just curious as to why you are certain it will not be. :confused:
I reckon deep down, they know how much of threat these carriers would be in the event one was used 'against us'. Or they do not want one being scrutinised by a 'potential enemy' whilst being dismantled - too much info to be gained.
Just a thought.
Does anyone know how far the dismatling process has eaten into the invincible
I would think that she must be just about gone....
Dreadnought
15-12-2011, 20:11
After Invincible’s third commission. the task of surveying her prior to her sale for dismantling was awarded to Lucion Marine, specialist surveyors. The survey was carried out over four weeks in November 2010.
When the Ministry of Defence auctione off Invincible, it was the Turkish ship breakers Leyal Ship Dismantling & Recycling that won. it has its built its name up over the past years as a ‘green’ ship recycling facility.
Turkey’s support for greener and safer ship recycling has been evidenced by the Prime Minister, Recep Tayyip Erdoğan, signing the International Maritime Organisation’s Hong Kong Convention for the Safe and Environmentally Sound Recycling of Ships 2009.
The procedures taken by the Ministry of Defence in the decommissioning and dismantling of Invincible shows that vessel recycling can be done safely and in an environmentally considerate manner. From having the vessel surveyed by Lucion Marine for hazardous materials prior to auctioning her off to a dismantling yard, allowed all parties to be aware of the location and amounts of hazardous materials, including asbestos, prior to work commencing on dismantling the vessel.
Invincible arrived at the Leyal Ship Recycling Limited yard at Port Aliaga, north of Izmar Turkey in April this year, and dismantling started in June. I would imagine, looking at the progress in the photos below, that she is razor blades by now.
I thnk some photographs similar to these might have ben posted before, but in any event, here are a selection to show her sad demise.
Very sad photos, Clive.
Steve
Sad photos, and I am sad to see her go. But, and its a big but, I think that many of you under-rate the navy we will have. Sure we would all like more ships, and in particular I would choose to have a few more frigates (but that is a centuries old story), but once the 2 QEC come into service, then the mix of those, T45s, T23s/T26s, SSNs and SSBNs and the assorted others will be a formidable force.
It may not be as large a force as the USN, but it is a force that will finally have put into place the lessons of the Falklands. Some will think that no great achievement, but when you look at the naval air strike power; the missile defences; and the vastly improved C4I (amongst other things), it is. Some of the lessons are ones that few other navies have truly learned, but then they didn't pay the price as we did.
So I think the RN has passed its low-point, and when QEC first enters Portsmouth it will be a source of pride for a navy that in reality punches above its weight for the size of the country- and needs to.
That all sounds cliched and propagandist, but I think you need to look at how much of an increase in capability ships such as QEC, T45 and Astute & modified T-boats give us
Thanks for the pics (sort of) sad to see her go like that
Is there a thread on here about the new type 26 class frigates can't seem to pick them up when I search for them
Dreadnought
16-12-2011, 13:04
Thread HERE (http://www.worldnavalships.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6500&highlight=frigates)Ludsie.
Thanks Clive
Enjoying the thread
Ludsie
After Invincible’s third commission. the task of surveying her prior to her sale for dismantling was awarded to Lucion Marine, specialist surveyors. The survey was carried out over four weeks in November 2010.
When the Ministry of Defence auctione off Invincible, it was the Turkish ship breakers Leyal Ship Dismantling & Recycling that won. it has its built its name up over the past years as a ‘green’ ship recycling facility.
Turkey’s support for greener and safer ship recycling has been evidenced by the Prime Minister, Recep Tayyip Erdoğan, signing the International Maritime Organisation’s Hong Kong Convention for the Safe and Environmentally Sound Recycling of Ships 2009.
The procedures taken by the Ministry of Defence in the decommissioning and dismantling of Invincible shows that vessel recycling can be done safely and in an environmentally considerate manner. From having the vessel surveyed by Lucion Marine for hazardous materials prior to auctioning her off to a dismantling yard, allowed all parties to be aware of the location and amounts of hazardous materials, including asbestos, prior to work commencing on dismantling the vessel.
Invincible arrived at the Leyal Ship Recycling Limited yard at Port Aliaga, north of Izmar Turkey in April this year, and dismantling started in June. I would imagine, looking at the progress in the photos below, that she is razor blades by now.
I thnk some photographs similar to these might have ben posted before, but in any event, here are a selection to show her sad demise.
Always very sad to see ships go this way... remember seeing her for the first time in Pompy in 1980.... seems a long time of go now.
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