ROYAL NAVY ROLL of HONOUR, WORLD WAR 1 Part 1 - by Name by Don Kindell

[stontamar]

Can anyone provide a comparison between this book and various volumes of the Cross Of Sacrifice which were published a number of years ago. This book along with volume 2 which list by date and ship/unit and volume 3 covering the period 1918-1939 are advertised through www.naval-history.net.

Whereas I can understand the reason for the list in date and ship/unit order I do not want to duplicate information I already have access to.

Regards

stontamar

[stontamar]

Can anyone provide a comparison between this book and various volumes of the Cross Of Sacrifice which were published a number of years ago. This book along with volume 2 which list by date and ship/unit and volume 3 covering the period 1918-1939 are advertised through www.naval-history.net.

Whereas I can understand the reason for the list in date and ship/unit order I do not want to duplicate information I already have access to.

Regards

stontamar

Presume no one who has read this post (111 reads) has actually seen one of these volumes? I may have to take the plunge and order volume 2, if I do I will post a review.

Regards

stontamar

[kin47]

Hello

May I make a statement on my books.

The Casualty Lists in my books are taken directly from Primary Sources, where Cross of Sacrifice is a Commonwealth War Graves Commission text, replete with errors and gaps. One thing that a reader will see is that I give the Given names in hundreds of instances only shown as initials in the CWGC literature and site.

One other bit of information. My Interwar Casualty Book has been nominated on the short list for the Mountbatten Maritime Prize. I can give excerpts, to anyone who is interested in any of the text. The Next Two books will be the WW II deaths.

All best

don

[Dreadnought]

Hi Don,

Just wanted to congratulate you on your work, I know you have put a tremendous amount of time and effort into putting it all together.

For those members not familiar with Don's work, his three books, covering Royal Navy losses from 1914 right through until 1939 are much acclaimed.


Review of "Roll of Honour" by Navy News, September 2009 - excerpts

Of the already lengthy list of essential reference works charting the long, proud history of the Royal Navy, now add the first volumes of a monumental work listing casualties from 1914 to the present.

Don Kindell's Royal Navy Roll of Honour intends to list, for the first time, every sailor or Royal Marine who died while in the Senior Service - in action, in accidents, as a result of illness. The author is a former US Navy sailor and police officer with a passion for the RN over four decades.

He's researched the details of 120,000 individuals whose records have been scattered around the archives - Kew, Whitehall, Commonwealth War Graves Commission, and the Naval Historical Branch among others.

The latter in particular has been heavily involved in what its head, Capt Christopher Page calls an "astonishing corpus of work".

And how right he is, Royal Navy Roll of Honour isn't a book you read as such, but it is one, serious naval, social and family historians will no doubt turn to time and again. The first three volumes (of a projected six to eight) deal with casualties of WW1 (two volumes, one by name and the other by date/ship) and the Inter-War period (by name and by date/ship).

We've only caught sight of the 'Between the Wars' volume, but it give an excellent idea of the quality of the research and the incredible usefulness of Mr Kindell's labour of love.

[stewart mcloughlin]

Forever grateful for your time and expertise Don.
Stewart

[stontamar]

Hello

May I make a statement on my books.

The Casualty Lists in my books are taken directly from Primary Sources, where Cross of Sacrifice is a Commonwealth War Graves Commission text, replete with errors and gaps. One thing that a reader will see is that I give the Given names in hundreds of instances only shown as initials in the CWGC literature and site.

One other bit of information. My Interwar Casualty Book has been nominated on the short list for the Mountbatten Maritime Prize. I can give excerpts, to anyone who is interested in any of the text. The Next Two books will be the WW II deaths.

All best

don

Many thanks for reply and for explaining the differences between the two sets of publications. I had tried on a couple of occasions to obtain the information I sought from NAVAL-HISTORY.NET, as that is where I have seen the books advertised for sale, but without any success. Failing that I hoped that some of the members on this web site would have obtained the books and been in a position to provide a review.

Will now consider whether to purchase the hard copies or PDF downloads.

Many thanks

stontamar

[stontamar]

Have now received the three volumes of The Royal Navy Roll of Honour produced by Don Kindell so far they are:

World War 1 1914-1918 Part 1 by Name
World War 1 1914-1918 Part 2 by Date and Ship/Unit
Between the Wars 1918-1939

All three volumes contain a wealth of detail and one wonders at the amount of time and effort, not to mention cost, involved in their compilation and I fully expect they will form an important part of my library and provide a readily available source of information for some time to come. Much of what is found in these volumes is available though other sources but the massive benefit provide by these volumes is that the information is for the first time readily available to the researcher without having to leave the chair.

The first book, World War 1 1914-1918 Part 1 by Name, is in many respects purely an index giving easy access to data listed in the second part. It is also less detailed in the information provide for each casualty so, for example, the entry in Part 1 for John ABRAMS T/Skip, RNR Arfon 30 April 1917 reports in Part 2 the AFRON was a hired trawler/minesweeper that was mined and sunk in the English Channel and then lists the other nine crew members who were killed in the same incident while serving on this vessel.

The deaths that occurred at a later date but which are related to an earlier incident are also recorded so, for example, we can learn that on Saturday 24 June 1916 Albert Matthew Boy 1st class died in HMS PEMBROKE, Chatham from wounds received while serving on HMS MALAYA at Jutland. He became the last casualty from HMS MALAYA which had previously lost 10 ratings who had died of wounds on the 1 June and another 12 ratings and 2 canteen staff that had died between the 2-23 June 1917 all of whom are named. This information, if previously available, would have taken a great deal of time and effort to compile.

There appears to be some differences between the information provided in World War 1 1914-1918 Part 1 by Name and that previously made available in the Cross of Sacrifice volumes that were published in the early 1990's and perhaps this is to be expected bearing in mind the wealth of sources used by Don when compared to the narrower CWGC based sourcing of the earlier work. I am not in a position as yet to explain or comment on these differences but what is immediately apparent is that Don Kindell has replaced the extensive use of initials used in the earlier work with full names and this has to be applauded.

The third volume brings together the list by name (index) and by date and ship/unit in one book and this is made possible by the reduced number of deaths record in the period 1918-1939 when compared to the number suffered during the 1914-18 period. The contents are however of the same high standard but what does immediate become apparent is the number of deaths caused by illness and accident.

I cannot vouch for all the entries being absolutely accurate and I doubt if the author would make such a claim and indeed, to re-enforce that need for continual improvement and accuracy, readers are requested to submit any alterations for inclusion in future updates if the original entry is shown to be inaccurate. To keep Don on his toes I have submitted one proposed change but do not let this deter anyone from buying into this work, you will not be disappointed.

This leads me on to which is the best format for those interested in purchasing the work, do you go for the PDF versions, which incidentally are much cheaper, or do you decided upon the hard copy version. My personal choice was the hard copy version mainly because I find it far more satisfying and easy to read a book rather than a PC screen. Others may prefer the PDF version which has the benefit of being searchable and perhaps most importantly is capable of being updated as new information is received. Perhaps Don may consider how best to update the hard copy version in due course?

The only negative aspect that I believe needs reporting is the quality of the paper and card covers used by the printers in the production of the books. They are quite sizeable and heavy publications and the lightweight paper products used do not help the books keep their shape and I expect that with constant use their condition will deteriorate quite significantly unless I take steps to provide some protection. As an immediate step I will be purchasing plastic sleeve covers but in the medium term I am considering having each volume bound in a hard back cover.

A tremendous volume of work and one that Don Kindell should be extremely proud of and I recommend these works to all who have an interest in this aspect of naval history, well done Don.

Regards

stontamar

[kin47]

Hello

To emphasis a point that has been raised before, I will repeat one of Stontamar's paragraphs from his earlier review.

"There appears to be some differences between the information provided in World War 1 1914-1918 Part 1 by Name and that previously made available in the Cross of Sacrifice volumes that were published in the early 1990's and perhaps this is to be expected bearing in mind the wealth of sources used by Don when compared to the narrower CWGC based sourcing of the earlier work. I am not in a position as yet to explain or comment on these differences but what is immediately apparent is that Don Kindell has replaced the extensive use of initials used in the earlier work with full names and this has to be applauded. "

Several people on other forums had did not think my editions had any information not already covered.

Thank you for listening.

All best

don