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John Seal
19-07-2009, 20:49
I hope this question isn't too trivial but I have several photos of warships with a heavy line going from the foredeck aft to the mid-section. What is it for, getting ready for coming alongside, taking on a tug....? See this Skyfoto shot of Ariadne as an example. John

CGRET
19-07-2009, 20:56
John Seal,

The line leading aft from the bow is used for the Ships Small Boat to keep it alongside when then are trying to retrieve the same. In the US Coast Guard
it is called a "Sea Painter".

Regards
Charles

qprdave
19-07-2009, 21:00
We have explained this previously, John

The Boats Painter. Was as you say, secured on the Foc'sle and went aft to the seaboat. This was to ensure that the boat remained in a fore and aft postion until the Cox'n had control then it would be released. It had a loop (eye) at the boats end and was secured inboard of the boat by placing the loop under the first Thwart (seat) and then placing a wooden block through the eye.

Once the cox'n had control the bowman would then release the painter by pulling the block of wood out and the painter would go over the side. About half way along the painter, there would be a smaller sized rope splice in and it was secured in the upper deck. when the seaboat released the painter, someone would haul on the smaller rope to recover the painter.

When the seaboat returned and was secured on the davits, the Painter would be replaced in the boat. I hope that this explains it. It was not used for recovery as the Cox'n controlled the boat by the engine and tiller until clear of the water

tonclass
19-07-2009, 21:12
John, that is a terrific pic of Ariadne, which I've not seen before. As for Nick, where is he ? Please give me a surname if you can ??????

John Seal
19-07-2009, 21:41
Thanks qprdave,
I think you can see the lighter line attached to the painter at the point where it crosses the deck.

qprdave
19-07-2009, 21:54
Thanks qprdave,
I think you can see the lighter line attached to the painter at the point where it crosses the deck.
Yes you can.

When the seaboat is being lowered there would be someone paying out the line until the boat was in the water. Making sure that the boats weight wasn't on the smaller line at all

Batstiger
19-07-2009, 22:10
I am sure someone will correct me if I am wrong but this line was called the boat rope.
When the seaboats crew was called away the davits were turned out , the boat was manned and lowered to just above the the water level where it would remain until the order Slip was given. On the order slip, the coxswain, usually the Killick of the watch on deck, would slip the boat from the falls. The tiller of the seaboat (which had been lashed in the position to take the boat away from the ships side) would do exactly this as the boat rope was intended to pull the boat foward and away from the ships side. When far enough clear from the side the coxswain would cut the lashing on the tiller turn the bows slightly towards the ships side so that the boat rope could be detached and away she would go. In my day the seaboat (whaler) was powered by oars but they were later powered by an engine.
The boat rope was then hauled back inboard by the remainder of the watch on deck.

May I also add John, that it is a great picture of the Ariadne?

"Away seaboats crew"

Regards, Bob.

astraltrader
20-07-2009, 08:43
Me too!! A brilliant picture John - any more of that size and quality and you can put them in the Special Warship Pictures Thread!!:)

Derek Dicker
20-07-2009, 12:14
Hi John, not sure when the picture was taken of Ariadne, as a very young sea cadet I think in 1955, I spent a week onboard for sea trials, think she was taken out of reserve for the purpose, sea was very rough and being empty (no mines), I spend most of the time in the mine deck being looked after by a very kind crew member, my first bout of sea sickness funny though didnt suffer after that..

Derek (Bunts)

qprdave
20-07-2009, 14:42
"I am sure someone will correct me if I am wrong but this line was called the boat rope."

Once again, Bob, your memory serves you better than me. Yes it was called the Boat Rope. Thanks for the correction.

CYLLA
20-07-2009, 14:44
As "tonclass " remarks a brilliant picture.

Can just slip in a ? ......is that the "lifebuoy ghost " we can see aft .

cylla

qprdave
20-07-2009, 15:15
I would like to know what the goofers by the For'd funnel below the Bofor are doing leaning on the guardrail while this photo is being taken. I am sure that the Jimmy would have had a heart attack if he saw them. Perhaps he did when the picture was developed. I wonder if he got the ships Plod to investigate. I would look no further than the stoker contingent!!!!!!!!!

Batstiger
20-07-2009, 16:23
I hope Ivor has noticed the fine example of the "Gash chute which all the Abdiels carried.

Bob.

tim lewin
21-07-2009, 04:57
the correct catenary of the boatrope was a favourite of skippers, log enough to give the sea boat a good pull away from the ships side but not too long as it hung in the oggin. When they introduced synthetic fibre rope i remember my father be pleased as punch by their elasticity which gave the sea boat that extra twang away; all in the days of pulling of course. Did the boat rope remain after 3-in-1s took over from whalers?
tim

Batstiger
21-07-2009, 10:34
When I was on the Tiger in 59/60 we had 3 in 1's and the boat rope was still used then Tim. I should imagine it still is in use, perhaps one of our younger members could let us know if this is still the practice.

Bob.

Rob Hoole
21-07-2009, 11:32
Boat ropes are still in use today for the RN's seaboats including Gemini inflatable dinghies and the RIBs (Rigid Inflatable Boats) that have replaced heavier boats like cutters and whalers so as to reduce topweight on today's warships. Interesting piccies of various seaboats belonging to the old Type 21 frigate HMS Ambuscade here (http://www.ambuscade.org.uk/am_sea_ops_boats.htm).

tim lewin
21-07-2009, 11:54
Here are some boatrope pics, first is Ashanti, then Urchin and last is a plaque from HMS Wizard when she was part of the Dartmouth Sqn.

tim lewin
21-07-2009, 11:58
I guess the Dartmouth Sqn held onto its montague pulling/sailing whalers as they were good for training! They still had pulling regattas once a year.

Buffer
21-07-2009, 12:15
Even though most ships have RIBS these days, the boat rope is still used for the original reasons already stated. It's good to see that something which has been around for donkeys years cannot be bettered.

ivorthediver
21-07-2009, 19:24
I hope Ivor has noticed the fine example of the "Gash chute which all the Abdiels carried.

Bob.


Yes Thanks Bob it did not escape my eye, a good photo to

Regards Ivor

John Seal
21-07-2009, 20:03
Well maybe not such a trivial question after all! What does the reference to the lifeboat ghost mean? And here's a photo of Eagle coming in to Malta, with the cutter down and the boat rope showing, but not apparently attached to the cutter. It's a Wright and Logan photo of 1928. John

Fairlead
21-07-2009, 20:18
Lifebuoy ghost was a term of endearment used for the Stern Lookout - more often than not he was all alone on the quarterdeck huddled into any shelter he could find (thus hard to find - ghost) and was tasked with keeping a lookout astern and in particular if anyone fell overboard, he would throw the stern lifebouy over the side. Part of the watch on deck, he would be rotated with others like bridge lookout, seaboats crew, wheelhouse duties etc.
As for the boatrope not being attached to the cutter being lowered from HMS EAGLE, the reason for this is that the ship is not moving through the water at any speed (note the outflow) so the boatrope would be of no use to pull the bow away from the side of the ship, as it would at sea.

Fairlead

qprdave
21-07-2009, 20:22
Yes Bob

The Montague 3in1 Whaler was in use up until 1978 when I left. I don't know how long after that when they were changed

John Seal
21-07-2009, 20:26
Lifebuoy ghost was a term of endearment used for the Stern Lookout - more often than not he was all alone on the quarterdeck huddled into any shelter he could find (thus hard to find - ghost) and was tasked with keeping a lookout astern and in particular if anyone fell overboard, he would throw the stern lifebouy over the side. Part of the watch on deck, he would be rotated with others like bridge lookout, seaboats crew, wheelhouse duties etc.

Many thanks!
As for the boatrope not being attached to the cutter being lowered from HMS EAGLE, the reason for this is that the ship is not moving through the water at any speed (note the outflow) so the boatrope would be of no use to pull the bow away from the side of the ship, as it would at sea.

And thanks again!

qprdave
21-07-2009, 20:27
Well maybe not such a trivial question after all! What does the reference to the lifeboat ghost mean? And here's a photo of Eagle coming in to Malta, with the cutter down and the boat rope showing, but not apparently attached to the cutter. It's a Wright and Logan photo of 1928. John
Life Buoy Ghost or, Life Buoy Sentry proper was a member of the watch on deck that remained on the quarterdeck at all times at sea.

Their job was to throw a life ring and a flare which was attached, overboard it if he saw a man in the ogin (Sea). He may even be told over the main broadcast if someone else has reported it.

tjstoneman
21-07-2009, 21:03
Some nice photos - many thanks to the posters. However, I suspect that the photo in post #1 is actually ARIADNE's sister ship APOLLO. ARIADNE went into reserve shortly after the war and never recommissioned, and this looks like a post-war photo. Also, whilst APOLLO definitely had single 20mm Oerlikons in sponsons just for'd of the bridge (as seen in this photo), I've not seen any photos of references to ARIADNE with such weapons there.
Tim

Batstiger
21-07-2009, 21:20
You are indeed correct in your assumptions Tim. The picture was taken in June 1953, I have the book Channel dash in front of me at this moment.

Bob.

Batstiger
21-07-2009, 21:30
Here is one of the Manxman from the same book.

Bob.

Batstiger
21-07-2009, 21:47
On borrowing one of Bob Shaylor's pictures of the Daring we can see that the practice of using a boat rope is still carried on in the present day even though you can't see the boat!

Bob.

BIG LES
21-07-2009, 21:49
The W O D actualy stayed by the whaler at all times.When i was on the carysfort we used to huddle at The bottom of the funnel to keep warm in cold climes and on the iron deck or torpedo deck if it was warm

ivorthediver
22-07-2009, 05:33
Here is one of the Manxman from the same book.

Bob.


Thank you Bob,

Excellent picture and shows detail I had not seen before, like the water tight doors on the port side behind B turret and beneath the anti aircraft guns.....in Front of the forward funnel