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designeraccd
27-01-2009, 18:52
Holmes: USS George H.W. Bush: Passing of an era?
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Athens Banner-Herald | Story updated at 6:28 pm on 1/23/2009


James Holmes

On Jan. 10, the U.S. Navy commissioned USS George H.W. Bush, the last of its Nimitz-class nuclear-powered aircraft carriers. Thousands of spectators, including the former president, gathered in Norfolk, Va., to "bring the ship to life," in ceremonial parlance. Proclaimed Navy Secretary Donald Winter, "The impact of a carrier is global, for no other ship represents to the world the power of the United States the way this does."

In 1988, as a fresh-faced engineering officer, I took part in a similar ceremony bringing the battleship Wisconsin back to life after nearly three decades in mothballs. Language like Winter's greeted the reactivation of these World War II-vintage dreadnoughts, but their modern lives were short. The Missouri, best known of the battleships, now is berthed at Battleship Row in Oahu, a symbol of victory over Imperial Japan.

Despite its iconic status, the Missouri already was a relic in 1945, when Gen. Douglas MacArthur and Japanese emissaries assembled on its teak decks to formalize Japan's surrender.

The destruction of the Pacific Fleet's battleships at Pearl Harbor had forced the navy to improvise. At the behest of Adm. Chester Nimitz, new instruments of naval war - submarines and hastily organized aircraft-carrier task forces - charged across the Pacific toward the Japanese home islands.

While battlewagons still had a part to play in naval operations, defending carriers and bombarding enemy shores, the new operating environment relegated them to support status. Never again would they regain their place at the center of U.S. naval strategy.

My old ship, the Wisconsin, is a waterfront museum in downtown Norfolk. For me, its presence almost in sight of the Bush commissioning is a metaphor for the likely fate of big-deck flattops. Defensive technologies are rendering surface vessels acutely vulnerable to attack.

While the surface fleet still has its uses, its staying power in a fleet engagement in Asia - the most likely theater for a high-intensity fight - is increasingly in doubt.

Why the bleak prophecy? In the 1890s, Alfred Thayer Mahan, father of the modern U.S. Navy, described "capital ships" - those comprising the heart of the battle fleet - as "the vessels which, by due proportion of defensive and offensive powers, are capable of taking and giving hard knocks." Battleships were capital ships for Mahan. But, just as air power rendered battleships more or less moot, new technologies appear to be overtaking carriers like the Bush.

China's People's Liberation Army is assembling an arsenal of weaponry designed specifically to hold off U.S. carriers and their escorts. One example is a revolutionary, shore-based "antiship ballistic missile" reportedly able to target ships hundreds of miles away.

By my back-of-the-envelope calculations (and assuming the antiship ballistic missile pans out), PLA missile forces will soon be able to strike at U.S. ships at the extreme range of cruise missiles and carrier-based aircraft.

If so, Mahan's axiom suggests that surface ships will find their offensive power blunted, their ability to defend themselves likewise on the decline.

The bottom line: No longer can U.S. naval leaders blithely assume they can station carrier task forces off foreign shores in times of crisis, nor can they assume U.S. hardware and prowess simply will overpower future opponents.

Is this an elegy for American sea power? No.

It is a call to rethink the makeup of the U.S. Navy. To me, a robust undersea fleet founded on nuclear submarines meets Mahan's standard better than one founded on surface vessels. Missile- and torpedo-armed boats can mete out tremendous punishment. And while they are no more sturdily built than carriers, they can cruise underwater almost indefinitely, eluding seagoing adversaries.

For lesser missions like battling pirates, interdicting contraband or rendering humanitarian assistance, surface vessels likely will remain the implements of choice. They are bigger, can carry more cargo and can survive in less threatening surroundings.

But tomorrow's fleet ought to look quite different from today's - just as the fleet that defeated Japan in 1945 scarcely resembled the fleet afire at Pearl Harbor in 1941.

• James Holmes is an associate professor of strategy at the Naval War College and a senior research fellow at the University of Georgia's Center for International Trade and Security. The views voiced here are his alone.

Originally published in the Athens Banner-Herald on Saturday, January 24, 2009

Given he helped bring "my" battleship back into service (BB 64), well he has to know of what he speaks! No BIAS here....! Sobering thoughts tho.... DFO :D

CGRET
27-01-2009, 19:21
Hello,

I find his statement is somewhat a backward step as far as how the US deploy's it military in the diplomatic areana. If I'm correct his opinion is that in this modern era that all warships, that is surface type's are obsolete. The only answer is the submarine.

Here's the flaw as I see it.

The carrier task force is made up of many warship's with multi-capablilities to counter any threat it may encounter. The modern warship has and does go through many upgrades to it's weapon's systems to counter these threat's. The submarines an important part in this task group as well, hunter-killer's.They as with the surface fleet go through the some process.

Then to say the Iowa's were obsolete at the end of world war 2 is a wrong assumption. They played a vital part in Korea and as well in Vietnam, although the reasoning behind the New Jersey being discomission was the US Navy did not find the extra 16" barrel's in it's inventory until after the order was given. The battleship still has a role in the modern navy. The capablilities of these ship's has not been touched by any navy in the world since the 70's. Moreover, what ship in the world can take numerous cruise missile hit's and stay afloat, none that I'm aware. What ships in the world has the amour plating like those ship's do, none that I know of. With modern weapon's that could be mounted on this ship's is mind blowing to say the least.

His statement date's back to Zumwalt's era and does not consider modern technology and what role it play's in the modern era of Warship's defense.


Regards
CGRET

designeraccd
27-01-2009, 19:57
I agree I'd rather go to battle at sea on BB 64 than an LCS, but I'm seeing more and more questioning of the continued RELEVANCE of the huge 100,000 ton CV. I personally don't support all subs, but I too am wondering @ the dependency we have on our now handful of super carriers....especially with the F/A-18 versions as the backbone of the airgroup. A good plane, but from what I read could be very marginal versus latest sov...err roooshunn fighters that the rooshunnz are so happy to supply to anybody with $$$.


Keeping an OPEN mind and searching for viable alternate answers is, based on my business, a very good thing. I suspect, as usual, the best answer will really end up someplace between 100K ton CVs and speedboats with rpgs! What..tho?? DFO :)

designeraccd
28-01-2009, 19:01
another blog sez............

Tuesday, January 27, 2009
Carrier Cuts Coming?
So...Insidedefense.com obtains an internal Navy note on the prospect of future budget cuts, and hidden in the last graph of their story is this tasty nugget:


The bulletin asserts the Navy mulled the idea of an eight-carrier Navy prior to the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks and that during the 1990s there was one year when the Navy bought only 43 aircraft, as opposed to the 180 to 220 that were needed. When “things get lean, everything goes on the table,” the message counsels, adding, “There will be very few sacred cows.”

Carrier cuts are inevitable, and we're going to see much more of this sort of "prepare the ground" info sneaking out of DC. Why? Because the moment a carrier or two gets tossed on the budget table, the temper tantrum that'll come from certain quarters of the Navy community will be unprecedented. Seriously. We've not seen nothin' yet!


Given our new President...this doesn't seem to fanciful; after all pelosi and reid have IMPORTANT priorities....just ask them....DFO :eek:

CGRET
28-01-2009, 20:11
Yes I do have an open mind, but when it comes to the backward's approach of some who think's his or there view best fit's the need's of a modern navy as it relates to the event's around the world, then it is time to step on some toe's.

Moreover, the current level of the Navy is do to drop by a wave of decommissioning in the near future. The Big E is currently under evaluation for this very possibility. Yes, there are new classes coming on line like the USS Liberty LCS-1 and a few of her sisters. Then the Coast Guard's new National Defence Cutter's are going to assume the Lotteral combat role in conjunction with the US Navy. So to say the Carrier in it's current form does not meet the current political need's of this country is "flawed" in it's process's.

Just some thought's

Regards
CGRET

designeraccd
28-01-2009, 20:47
IMhO many of the current USN designs-specifically LCS right now-have huge cost overuns + late deliverys.............good grief. NEVER would have swept the Pacific in WW II at this rate! aaaarrrgh!

I do believe lotsa creative DISCUSSION needs to occur to THINK thru what really will be useful over next 40-50 years...now wherezz my crystal ball?! DFO :(

designeraccd
28-01-2009, 23:25
uh-huh...slash the non important stuff, but lets PLANT GRASS on the National MALL............







By Dale Eisman
The Virginian-Pilot
© January 28, 2009
WASHINGTON

Defense Secretary Robert Gates gave lawmakers a carefully hedged defense Tuesday of Navy plans to relocate a Norfolk-based aircraft carrier to Florida and agreed to consider whether the move is worth its price tag of $600 million or higher.

"I do worry about everything being concentrated in one port on the East Coast, which does receive a lot of hurricanes," Gates told the House Armed Services Committee. But any move is "six or seven years in the offing," Gates said, and both he and a new Navy secretary will review the cost and the risk to the fleet before proceeding.

Navy Secretary Donald Winter, who plans to leave office by March, endorsed plans this month to move one of the five Atlantic Fleet flattops to Mayport Naval Station in Florida as a hedge against a natural disaster or terrorist attack on Hampton Roads.

The move would shift about 3,000 sailors from Hampton Roads to the Mayport area, near Jacksonville, and siphon hundreds of millions of dollars annually from the local economy. State and local officials argue that any risk of keeping all the ships together is minimal and that the Navy has other, more pressing needs for its limited funds.

The Navy maintains two carrier ports on the West Coast. Mayport was home to a conventional carrier, the John F. Kennedy, until it was retired in 2007. The $600 million or more needed to move a nuclear carrier to the Florida base - the Navy has no more conventional carriers - would finance construction of special facilities associated with maintaining the ship's nuclear power plant.

In separate hearings Tuesday, Rep. Randy Forbes, a Chesapeake Republican, and Sen. Jim Webb, a Democrat, told Gates that the Navy decided to relocate a carrier to Mayport without a detailed risk analysis. An admiral involved in drafting the Navy plan told Forbes informally that the risk of an event in Hampton Roads knocking out the entire carrier fleet is less than 10 percent, Forbes said.

Webb said the Navy's plan is symptomatic of a planning process "so out of control that we're not focusing on the areas that can truly help the country, like rebuilding the fleet and putting aircraft out there into the squadrons."

He said Navy procurement programs for ships and planes "are in total disarray" and noted that the Navy had gone through the most dangerous days of the Cold War with only one nuclear-capable carrier port on the East Coast.

In other testimony Tuesday, Gates warned lawmakers that some of the military's most coveted new weapons programs could face cancellation this year or next as the Obama administration confronts "hard choices" on defense spending forced by the demands of two wars and the nation's economic crisis.

"The spigot of defense funding opened by 9/11 is closing," he said.

The defense chief gave no hint of which programs are endangered, but he had kind words for a Navy initiative, the littoral combat ship, that has been plagued by cost overruns. The fast and highly maneuverable ship, designed for close-to-shore missions, "is really needed," Gates said.

Some of the Pentagon's costliest new weapons are being developed by the Navy, including the new Ford class of aircraft carriers - being built at Northrop Grumman's Newport News shipyard - and the DDG-1000 destroyer.

The initial Ford carrier is projected to cost nearly $14 billion, including expenses for research, development and design. Navy officials say costs will drop to around $8 billion per hull, comparable to carriers in the former Nimitz class, with subsequent ships.

The carrier program has subcontractors in more than 40 states, creating a built-in constituency in Congress. But the high cost of the ships, and continuing questions among some lawmakers about whether the Navy needs the 11-carrier fleet now set by federal law, could make the carrier program an attractive target for the new administration's cost-cutting.

designeraccd
29-01-2009, 11:56
Then there is this VIEW................DFO :eek::D