Submarine E51 Crew 1918

[Patwalker37srpen]

This submarine carried out the blood chilling process of mine laying for its career during WW1. The Officer in charge is Lt HR Marrack ( a relative) who went on to become a Rear Admiral after a very illustrious career and earned a DSC.
German submarines were known for their liking in attacking soft targets such as trawlers and small boats so the Admiralty tried a ruse to combat this.
They had a British submarine towed beneath the surface behind a trawler and connected by a tow rope and linked by a telephone link.
If a German sub surfaced near the trawler with the obvious intention of attacking it the telephone was used to advise the submerged sub to cast off and then hopefully it could manoeuvre to an attack position.
Thus it was that Lt Marrack on several occasions found himself dressed in seaman`s clothing and thick sweater and pretending to be part of the crew of the trawler. No German subs took the bait on his trips but I believe it did work on more than one other boat.
He also was in a `C` class sub that came to the rescue of another sub caught on the surface and machine gunned with severe damage and casualties and helped tow them to port.
He had a long career being on C10, A9, C19, E51, L71, K8, and M3 with the huge gun.
He was lent to the Australian navy in 1927 once the building of HMAS Oxley was complete and then had the task of sailing her to Australia. Unfortunately she developed engine bearing problems in passage and had to stop at Malta for many months for the problem to be resolved.
He was then posted to Command HMS Vulcan and later HMS Titania. Next he had HMS Medway on the China station where there was the unfortunate ramming while surfaced of HMS Poseidon by a chinese steamer.
He returned to the UK and was appointed to HMS Carlisle an anti aircraft Cruiser which he took down to Simonstown Naval base in South Africa where he became O/C the base there.
He returned to the UK for the start of the war and was O/C Shearness and involved with Operation Dynamo. Later in the war he took over the Naval Base at Gibraltar.
The only other person named in the photo is CPO Warren M.S.M. who is seated on the left end of the 2nd row. This info came from his grandson who saw one of my posts on the net and was good enough to let me have a copy of the picture.
If you look carefully there is a dog being held on the lap of the 4th man seated from the left.

[Patwalker37srpen]

For some reason it would not open the picture after the text.

[romft1945]

For some reason it would not open the picture after the text.

Make sure the picture is jpeg and the right size hope this helps.

[historydavid]

One example of the ruse was the Decoy vessel TARANAKI which towed submarine C 24.

[Patwalker37srpen]

You would not believe how much trouble this one picture has caused ! The reason it did not load was it was 1.9 mb and then it was in another memory area I could not access and then it was in ...zip etc.

[Patwalker37srpen]

One thing my son (who is a Chief Petty Officer in the Fleet Air Arm at Culdrose) mentioned when he saw this picture was the guy on the right end of the second row appears to be a PO with two stripes yet is wearing a `square-rig` hat and is wearing two medal ribbons which are a little difficult to see.
I wonder if anyone can make out what they are ?
I know the PO seated at the left end of the second row won a MSM during the war but this does not show. Presumably won later. As far as I can see no other rank appears to be wearing a medal ribbon.

[Patwalker37srpen]

I have tried to touch up and re-send the picture to make it a litttle more clear to view when I realised the first was somewhat `foggy`.

[Batstiger]

Pat, the fellow you pointed out would be an acting Petty Officer. When rated up they would wear square-rig for twelve months before the rank would be substantiated. I see he is also wearing a Bosuns chain.
As to the medal ribbons I cant help you but have enlarged the pic to see if the experts can help. I have also cleaned the picture up a bit.

Bob.

[dennis a feary]

Pat, a little late - only just visited this Thread.
Here are two awards to Lt. MARRACK ;

MARRACK Hugh R N/E Lt. RN 82O045 S/M E.51
Captain (S) Harwich 17.04.18 Gazetted
In Minelaying Submarines DSC
Has completed eight mine-laying trips, all of which have been carried out under very difficult circumstances, and the last three of which have been carried out under particularly hazardous circumstances, entailing as they did dificult navigation inside and among our minefields. It is thought that the mines laid by "E.51" are responsible for the destruction of two enemy submarines. Lieutenant Marrack has inpressed me very much by his keeness in working out and carrying through his hazardous duties.

MARRACK Hugh R DSC Lt. RN 82O054 S/M E.51
Senior Naval Officer Harwich N/E N/E
In Attack by Enemy Seaplanes 06.07.18 N/E
Their Lordships' commendation conveyed to Lieutenant Marrack for his conduct on the 6th July, 1918. But for his timely arrival on the scene nothing would have been heard of "C.25" again.

Regards Sadsac

[Bee]

Interesting looking picture, Pat. To me it looks like something has happened either during or just before the picture was taken. The man 5th along in the 2nd back row looks either worried or sick. The Officer? 2nd in from right in same row seems to be staring intently at the worried looking individual and one of the men (4th along in back row) appears to be staring at the Officer. Whilst all the men in between Officer and "worried man" look like they're studiously ignoring whatever it is that has gone off.

By the way, which one is Lt Marrack? (I'm sure it's probably obvious to you naval personel...but not me):confused:

Regards,
Bee
p.s. Bob, I like the way you "plumped" them up again too :)

[romft1945]

Interesting looking picture, Pat. To me it looks like something has happened either during or just before the picture was taken. The man 5th along in the 2nd back row looks either worried or sick. The Officer? 2nd in from right in same row seems to be staring intently at the worried looking individual and one of the men (4th along in back row) appears to be staring at the Officer. Whilst all the men in between Officer and "worried man" look like they're studiously ignoring whatever it is that has gone off.

By the way, which one is Lt Marrack? (I'm sure it's probably obvious to you naval personel...but not me):confused:

Regards,
Bee
p.s. Bob, I like the way you "plumped" them up again too :)

I would say Lt Marrack is the Officer in the middle and if you had been on a sub in those days you would be sick it was bad enough in the 60s
ROM

[Bee]

Thanks for that, Rom. Yes, I've always imagined it'd be fairly horrible to be in a submarine and the early ones would have been particularly uncomfortable for the crew. I wonder if they had any idea of what it'd be like when they joined up...would they have had a choice of which service they went into, even?
Regards,
Bee

[romft1945]

Sub service was by choice but these days as they are like floating hotels it is a draft no questions asked but I still believe wrens are not allowed (but we wont go into that)

[Patwalker37srpen]

Sorry I have not been on the site for quite some time so missed your helpful comments. I have actually got copies of both citations from the NA at Kew.
The story of the C 25 attack is very interesting. Apparently it was on the surface and saw some aircraft which it took to be friendly. These circled round and then attacked catching the men on the Conning tower and killing the Captain. While unable to dive for a while they received further punishment from bullet strikes which amazingly punctured the conning tower and the hull in many places. Men were hard at it below hammering wooden bungs into these holes to try and allow the boat to submerge.
Lt Marrack came along just in time and drove off the aircraft with gunfire which undoubtedly saved the sub from fatal punishment.

[Patwalker37srpen]

I have just been and looked in my files and the two German submarines thought to have been sunk by his mines were UB 61 and UB 75 plus an armed trawler.
I cant imagine if you were submerged and hit an enemy mine there would be any survivors. It would be instaneous for all since I dont think that in those days the subs were compartmentised.

[dennis a feary]

Hello Pat, here are the other two officers in the photo ;

Lt GARNONS Gerald
Lt THOMPSON Leslie RNR

Have some names of crew in pic if you wish.

Sadsac

[Patwalker37srpen]

Dear Dennis,
That is very interesting about names, I dont suppose you can identify them within the picture can you.?

[dennis a feary]

Pat, cannot be too certain as to who is which, but here are some names & ranks of ratings in the pic. May be able to pick out some by their rank. All I can say is that those names I give were listed serving on E51 at the date in the photo.

BURTON Samuel L/Seaman
CHITTY Albert Cox - so probably the one in `square rig' spoken of
CHRISTIAN Stanley
COLLINS Ernest CSTO
COMBES Ernest STO
COTTERILL Frank AB LTO
CROSS Stanley PO LTO
BROOKFIELD Sydney STO1
DONALD Hugh AB
EUSTACE Ernest ERA2 - one senior ratings standing to left of pic ??
FRANCE Alfred AB LTO
GATHERGOOD Joseph LSTO

More later

Sadsac

[Patwalker37srpen]

Dear Dennis,
Thanks for those names. I have printed them off for my Family file.
Once again I have not visited the site for some weeks for which I apologise.
Patrick

[dennis a feary]

OK Patrick, quite understand re `late posting' - we all have other lives to live.
Only just seen your reply.
Here are some more of the chaps that were serving on/in E51 at time of photo ;

GOODCHILD Bertram SPO
HUTCHINSON John LSTO
HARBORD David ERA
HOWELL Bertram TEL
MASTERMAN Arthur PO TGM
MCLEAN Samuel LSTO
MURTHEA Francis PO LTO
SIMPSON Herbert PO LTO
SMITH Lenard LSIG

More Later if you wish

Sadsac

[BALTICSUBS]

Hi All,

in relation to the C25 attack, E51 took off C25's remaining crew with Marrack boarding C25 at one stage, he took C25 in tow until 4 German aircraft returned. E51 actually abandoned the C25 for these understandable reasons and dived to safety, and when she resurfaced Mararck took the aircraft on with her 12 pounder gun and was bombed herself, the destroyer Lurcher rescued C25 and towed her into port.

DB.

[BALTICSUBS]

Hi Dennis

the chap you have as Bertram Goodchild here, does not come up, was he RNR?

Cheers DB

[dennis a feary]

DB - just had another look at GOODCHILD - I have him down as BERTIE not Bertram as I posted. RNR ?? Well I have him as RN - and he is !!
Confirmation you can find in NA file Seamans Services ADM 188 / 887
GOODCHILD Bertie Frederick P.o.B ; Derby D.o.B ; 140392
Off No. ; K10140

Good Hunting

Sadsac

[BALTICSUBS]

Thanks again Dennis.

[Nigel999]

I have just been and looked in my files and the two German submarines thought to have been sunk by his mines were UB 61 and UB 75 plus an armed trawler.
I cant imagine if you were submerged and hit an enemy mine there would be any survivors. It would be instaneous for all since I dont think that in those days the subs were compartmentised.

Beleive it or not, H8 (B L Johnson) was actually mined while dived and survived! A lot of forward casing was blown off but survive she did.
I beleive that H8 is unique in this.

Dave Perkins book on Canadian Submariners goes into depth about it.

Cheers, Nigel