View Full Version : Non-Naval Jet Aircraft
astraltrader
17-02-2008, 17:32
This weeks selection is aimed at any of you who like me have a keen interest as well in earlier jets..
The shot of the Luftwaffe Sabre and a couple of the Lightnings are amongst my favourite jet photographs...
Back to WW2 photo`s next time.
The Sailor
17-02-2008, 23:00
SUPERMARINE SWIFT
Specifications
Base Series Designation: Supermarine Swift
Classification Type: Fighter Aircraft
Contractor: Supermarine - UK - View All
Country of Origin: United Kingdom
Initial Year of Service: 1952
Crew / Passengers: 1
Production Total: 14* - View Totals Page
*Sometimes an estimate when actual production numbers
are not available. A value of 0 indicative of NA.
DIMENSIONS:
Length: 41.47 ft | 12.64 m
Wingspan/Width: 32.32 ft | 9.85 m
Height: 12.47 ft | 3.80 m
Empty Weight: 12,518 lbs | 5,678 kg
MTOW: 17,022 lbs | 7,721 kg
PERFORMANCE:
Engine(s): 1 x Rolls-Royce Avon RA7 turbojet with afterburn generating 7,500lbs of thrust. - Compare Stats
Maximum Speed: 690 mph | 1,110 km/h | 599 kts
Maximum Range: 730 miles | 1,175 km
Service Ceiling: 45,030 ft | 13,725 m | 8.5 miles
Climb Rate: 12,300 ff/min (3,752 m/min)
ARMAMENT:
External Hardpoints: 0
Armament:
2 x 30mm cannons
Commodore Armiger
18-02-2008, 10:37
I don't recall any of these aircraft serving with the Fleet Air Arm or its equivalents in other Navies. Perhaps a Canberra was used for target-towing?
astraltrader
18-02-2008, 13:33
Actually Sailor the gentleman does have a point as I appear to have posted these in shore leave by mistake! They should have gone into Everything else section. I have remedied - apologies! Interesting information about the Swift - I always found it an underrated fighter from the viewpoint of Aviation histoty...
The Sailor
18-02-2008, 13:46
Check out this site Terry
http://search.live.com/images/results.aspx?q=me+262&mkt=en-au#
astraltrader
18-02-2008, 13:50
Fantastic images Sailor - I always had a great fascination for the ME-262. It was good fortune for the Allies that Hitler wrongly insisted on their useage as a sort of fighter-bomber rather than something to tear into our bombers!
The Sailor
18-02-2008, 13:54
The RAF had the Meteor operational and had withheld it from contact with the 262. The swarms of P-51s were adequate. However it was ready and so was the Vampire, so the Luftwaffe would have been blasted from the skies on way or another.
astraltrader
18-02-2008, 14:01
I think the ME-262 would have been more than a match for the earlier Meteor...
The Sailor
18-02-2008, 14:04
They weren't even a match for the P-51s. The Mustangs hung around until they were out of fuel and blasted them whilst landing.
Commodore Armiger
18-02-2008, 14:04
My point, and I shall continue to make it until I bore people back to their senses, is that this is a naval ships forum. I am as interested by the war in the air as I am in the war at sea, but I wouldn't expect to find pieces about submarines in a forum about aircraft - unless the subject was submarines that carried airraft of course.
astraltrader
18-02-2008, 14:11
Commodore Armiger - This section was designed by the seniors here as an informal area where all sorts of topics can be discussed. If you look at the threads here they cover subjects as wide as aviation to favourite films watched...
Sailor - I can`t agree with you on the ME262 verses the Meatbox!
Maritime Michael Ian
18-02-2008, 21:49
Gentlemen may I add a little??
One of the best carrier born aircraft, so I have been led to believe, was the Scimitar! I can remember seeing some sitting on the flight deck of a carrier, but cannot remember her name, but I do remember seeing some shore based ones when travelling through the Singapore Straits in 1965, aboard M.V. Fairsky, when we were buzzed by about half a dozen! I subsequently heard that the squadron had been 'off loaded' to the RAF base there for a period...don't know why. I also gather that these aircraft were quite heavy...probably needed to be if they had to slam down on a carrier's deck!
Ian
Commodore Armiger
19-02-2008, 06:52
Here's a good link about Scimitars:
http://www.thunder-and-lightnings.co.uk/scimitar/history.html
and a quote for those who lack time to read the whole thing:
The Scimitar was, at the time of its introduction, the heaviest and most powerful aircraft ever to serve in the Fleet Air Arm. While innovations such as angled decks helped, the situation with these large and fast aircraft and small aircraft carriers meant that take-offs and landings were an increasingly dangerous business. While the Americans simply built bigger carriers, this luxury was not available to the RN, which was becoming increasingly pressurised to save money, not spend it. The Scimitar's design included a tail bumper so that the aircraft could be rested on it for take-off, with the nosewheel high in the air, actually off the deck. The increased angle of attack meant the less powerful catapults on the RN's small carriers could still manage to bring a heavy (and heavily loaded) aircraft like the Scimitar to flying speed.
Accidents began to mount up - in-flight fires, landing accidents by the dozen, ditchings and plain old crashes. The general consensus these days is that the RN was simply not experienced enough in operating such an advanced and heavy aircraft. The limited size of the carriers also meant that landing accidents became far more serious than they would otherwise have been. In all, 76 Scimitars were actually produced (the last batch of 24 having been cancelled), and no less than 39 were lost in a variety of accidents - an attrition rate of over 51% over the Scimitar's service life!
Perhaps someone can tell us whether such an appalling attrition rate has ever been exceeded by any other carrier-based aircraft type. Remember that this was in peace-time. 50 years on it is hard to imagine the Navy accepting such losses - or perhaps more importantly these days the Treasury!
astraltrader
19-02-2008, 12:04
Thank you Commodore Armiger for that interesting link on what was the last Supermarine fighter..
Here some more old Jets,
4595245953459544595545956459574595845959
Regards
Charles
Here's another old jet,
The video is showing new built ME-262 Flying.
http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=stormbirds&hl=en&emb=1&aq=f#q=ME-262&hl=en&emb=1
Regards
Charles
More old jets,
459694597045971459724597345974
Regards
Charles
A few more,
46173461744617546176461774617846179
Regards
Charles
harry.gibbon
13-05-2009, 22:05
More old jets,
459694597045971459724597345974
Regards
Charles
Charles,
Re brilliant pic of TSR2... what did they think the chase plane, a Meatbox was going to do? she(the TSR2) was on full re-heat just taking off!!!!!
Little h
Little h,
Thank You!
I have pondered that very idea. The only workable solution is the TSR-2 is going to be preforming some low-speed exercises in which the meatbox(meteor) can stay her to observe.
Only if the aircraft had gone into production!!!!!!
Regards
Charles
harry.gibbon
13-05-2009, 23:06
Charles,
If only the USAF had sent an F104 Chase plane;) then perhaps the USAF and others would have been flying this superior aircraft. My views are posted on another thread.. an unforgiveable loss to air superiority in my opinion :mad:
Nice to exchange views with you though,
Little h
Little h,
I would agree with your comments 100%. The F-104 was available from Turkey, Italy, Germany. The USAF's F-104's had a short service life compared to other aircraft, being the last ones were retired from the Air Guard in the 70's.
Regards
Charles
harry.gibbon
13-05-2009, 23:49
Little h,
I would agree with your comments 100%. The F-104 was available from Turkey, Italy, Germany. The USAF's F-104's had a short service life compared to other aircraft, being the last ones were retired from the Air Guard in the 70's.
Regards
Charles
Charles, just the converse... although the F104 was fast... my comments were a bit tongue in cheek ... the air superiority would have come from the TSR2 which the US Govt put undue pressure on to have scrapped.
Little h
Little h,
Not a problem. I understand now, thanks for enlighting me.
Regards
Charles
harry.gibbon
14-05-2009, 00:01
Charles.
The prev thread was Dismantling the Fleet post WW2... and the views of a number of us are contained there-in!
Little h
Charles
Excellent pic of the TSR2 taking off from Boscombe Down I feel, perhaps Rik will be able to confirm. Yes, regretably the US 'did' for the TSR2 just like they 'did' for De Havilland's Arrow in Canada. Both for the same reason - didn't like the competition, the 'and by the way if you don't scrap it you won't be able to play in our gang' scenario springs to mind!! In the case of the Arrow, the Russians had the last laugh as they had spies embedded in DH Canada who were feeding all the design details back to the motherland. A Russian 'Arrow' subsequently took to the skies but I can't remember the builder. It was on a Discovery Channel prog I happened across one evening.
Although the RN didn't fly Canberras operationally, they were used for target towing around the gunnery range at the now long gone HMS Cambridge at Wembury Point near Plymouth.
The pix of the Lightning bring back memories of the time that one came low level along the runway at Chivenor, North Devon, got midway and then stood on its tail with both reheats going and disappeared into orbit. Must of woke half of North Devon up that morning!! Of course that was in the days when the RAF, and the RN come to that, actually had enough fuel to fly their aircraft in real time!!
Regards
Mik
Regards
Mik
Mik,
I would agree with you on the part the US had in the TSR-2 Project, very sad indeed!
Great story of the lightning going vertical after take-off! Thanks for sharing it.
Regards
Charles
ivorthediver
14-05-2009, 19:10
Mik,
I would agree with you on the part the US had in the TSR-2 Project, very sad indeed!
Great story of the lightning going vertical after take-off! Thanks for sharing it.
Regards
Charles
Hi Mik / Charles I to remember the lightning doing the same thing at Waterbeach Cambs in the early Seventies what a mover.....it came in silently from one side feet above the runway then vertical at a split second and then what a noise ...just stood there speachless I have never seen another jet move so fast to this day
astraltrader
14-05-2009, 19:32
Yes I always loved the Lightning above all other British Jets - a class of its own!
I show here a picture of a Fiat G91 with the German Air force along with another great picture of a Lightning.
The Fiat does look incredibly like the D-variant of the F-86 Sabre which was always another of my favourite 1950`s Jets.
ivorthediver
14-05-2009, 19:56
Yes Terry I totally agree with you there ...
I was lucky enough to sit in the cockpit of the lightning at Duxford.. and was horrified just how little room there was inside, I can only think that Lightening pilots were hand picked dwarfs.......unless they were never intended to be used by 6ft.2" pilots...very cramped but non the less a wonderful Aircraft
I was once told that there only weakness was endurance in that if on reheat it had time to intercept and return only ....but there again I was also told that thats exactly what it was designed for ..and had no rivals.......
I know I'm a sad case...but I don't wear an anorak .........honest
astraltrader
14-05-2009, 20:34
I agree with you entirely Ivor. I think using re-heat the Lightning had only about 45mins flying time on full tanks. Just about enough time to scramble check out the Bear[s] over the North Sea and land again!:)
harry.gibbon
14-05-2009, 21:43
Please remember folks that the Lightning was essentially a research aircraft and only after recognition of the high speeds achieved was it eventually pressed into fighter configuration.
Then it had ventral tanks fitted, then it had bigger tanks fitted, then it had Avon guns fitted and under wing rocket launchers, then the full fit in its final guise.
It was still a sight to behold (and hear) in near vertical climb with full reheat.
Little h
PS ...Sorry for misleading .. if I remember correctly the rocket launchers were fitted in pods over wing and/or under wing
Terry,Ivor,Little h,
I agree with your commments on the Lightning. If I am not mistaken there is a company out of South Africa that still fly's the lightning on the air show circuit. Truly an amazing aircraft!!
The middle photo in terry's post is a G91 built by Fiat. Yes, the F-86 inspired the design of the aircraft. But I too would agree with terry on his view of the F-86! It's truely amazing that the F-86 fly in front line service until the 80's, Peru being the last to use this aircraft.
Regards
Charles
Here some more,
4628246283462844628546286
Regards
Charles
ivorthediver
15-05-2009, 05:33
Nice pics Charles...like the artwork on the last one and the flying
Regards Ivor
Ivor,
Thank you for your comments. Here is G91 built by Fiat. My mistake on terry's post!
46329
Classic lines of the North Amercian F-86 inspired this design.
Regards
Charles
astraltrader
15-05-2009, 16:00
A great plane! As I might have mentioned before in Jeffs excellent thread about War Movies, one of my favourite War films ever dealing with air-combat was the 1957 film The Hunters starring Robert Mitchum and Robert Wagner. It was all about the duel with Migs in Korea and features some really stunning aerial shots of Sabres - in Colour. Definitely the "top-gun" type movie of the 1950`s. I dont think that it has been transferred to DVD yet but is occasionally shown on British TV. If you ever get chance to see it and you havent seen it before you will love it.
Personally I prefer it to Top Gun!
Terry,
Great photo! Show's the F-86 off in a very classic way. The aircraft looks to be maintained in tip top condition.
Regards
Charles
astraltrader
15-05-2009, 16:15
Have you ever seen The Hunters?
Terry,
I have and you are right about the top guns of the 50's! Excellent movie and I am still looking to buy a copy when i can find it in VHS or CD form. So many good movies put out then like Stratagic Air Command, Another classic i have found on the interent video sites is one where the RAF is being taugh the killing zones on the B-29. That was in response to the russian copy of that aircraft TU-4.
Regards
Charles
warshipdisposal
30-05-2009, 16:55
hi all some from me, the HARRIER fascinates me particularly when you look at the initial thrust of the original early shars @12,500lbs there was not a great deall of power compared to when SHARS finished a few years ago the thrust had increased two fold to 24000 lbs of thrust, also the attrition rate was quite high of the shar with quite a few losses over the years.
Also without a doubt the phantom was the best looking and meanest a/c the navy had, if wed have had some during the falklands the args would not have even taken off
Vegaskip
30-05-2009, 18:22
If your into Phantoms, Sabres and other jet a/c, have a look in Jims Ship Paintings, Phantom 111Sqd is post #69
harry.gibbon
30-05-2009, 22:24
Geepers ha ha, well its about the 60's initt:D
These UK A/C of the period are FANTASTIC!!! I keep coming back to this thread and just enthuse at the quality A/C we produced in this country:).
Javillin, Lightning, Canberra, Buccaneer, TSR2 etc etc nobody on earth could match them, but some did use them (calling them by a different marque) BEFORE putting the boot in and ensuring we never got the upper hand manfucturing wise.
Soddin shame we never had the Politicians with the international clout to overcome this prejudice against our A/C design and manufacture!!!:mad:
Little h
Hells Bells!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I've entered Wafu country with a Seaman's Passport and no visa!!!!!
harry.gibbon
30-05-2009, 22:50
Dave, You never left the platform from which you operated/originated ... Aircraft are/were/'ain't ever' the exclusive domain of the WAFU's on account of the fact that some of us always had an interest in these magnificient machines, even though we remained yer aktual matelot..
On an 'O' boat a Submarine Ocificer doing his rounds in the foreends once said to me.."what are you doing reading your OWN edition of (a particular year) Janes ..... Aircraft" to which I replied " I was in the Army Cadets, I joined the Navy and I have an interest in Aeroplanes" ... he bu..ered oft quick style.
Stay a while, from their engines came the propulsion for our fleet of ships...
excluding of course Nuclear!!
Little h
I must admit. I used to like watching the Harriers takeoff/land on the Hermes in 1976.It started off doing trials in the Channel ended up going up through the North Sea round the top and down the west coast looking for bad weather!!!!
"Stay a while, from their engines came the propulsion for our fleet of ships...
excluding of course Nuclear!!"
I didn't know that aircraft had F.F.O. fired Boilers!!!!!!
Vegaskip
31-05-2009, 08:44
Any one remember the Scimitars with the dustbin permanantly hanging under the dump valve when on deck. I would love to have the value of all that contaminated fuel. (the bit on the cartoon about solid FFO was to tie in the 'trimmer' bit and it gets round you boffins telling me that the Lochs were'nt coal burners!)
Vegaskip
31-05-2009, 14:44
Also without a doubt the phantom was the best looking and meanest a/c the navy had, if wed have had some during the falklands the args would not have even taken off[/QUOTE]
Specialy for 'warshipdisposal' I painted this one about 15 years ago, this is a photo of the original, which I lost
47372 Sorry about the quality, VF111 'Sundowners' USN and 111 Squadron RAF ( presently based at Leuchars about 10 mls from where I sit, now equiped with Tornado's)
harry.gibbon
31-05-2009, 15:02
"Stay a while, from their engines came the propulsion for our fleet of ships...
excluding of course Nuclear!!"
I didn't know that aircraft had F.F.O. fired Boilers!!!!!!
Dave, didn't I read that the last FFO burning RN vessel just 'pulled in' last month having finished its service... so I am correct...really!! Little h
Here is a link for you Supermarine Scimitar F.MK.1 guys.
http://www.airliners.net/search/indexsearch.main?&nr_of_rows=596&first_this_page=500&page_limit=100&sort_order=aircraft_generic&nr_pages=6&thumbnails=S&engine_version=T
Enjoy
Charles
ivorthediver
01-06-2009, 05:27
Here is a link for you Supermarine Scimitar F.MK.1 guys.
http://www.airliners.net/search/indexsearch.main?&nr_of_rows=596&first_this_page=500&page_limit=100&sort_order=aircraft_generic&nr_pages=6&thumbnails=S&engine_version=T
Enjoy
Charles
Thanks Charles...another trip down memory lane for me.....
Attached are some photos my old man took at some airshows of the day, probably at Leuchars, and probably in the 70's. There are a couple of non-jets sneaking in - a Shackleton, a Hercules (I think) and even a helicopter, but most are modern jets - Vulcan, Jaguar etc etc. If I remember my aircraft correctly, there is also a DC-10 in there too - I was sat next to one of them while I was a passenger on a Tristar at Brize Norton.
ivorthediver
17-06-2009, 18:59
Thanks kc....
.the Vulcan god that brings back some memories......the hours I put in on the flight deck instruments in the one at Duxford before I transferred to the B29
harry.gibbon
17-06-2009, 22:02
Pic #1 4th row me thinks is the fabulous VC 10!!!
Little h
ivorthediver
20-06-2009, 19:34
Any more pictures kc ? please
Any more pictures kc ? please
Sorry ivor, that's all of the ones I have, except for a couple of very similar - almost duplicate - shots.
ivorthediver
20-06-2009, 20:37
Thanks for looking anyway
Regards Ivor
Ivor,
Just for you mate.
495494955049551
Enjoy!
Regards
Charles
ivorthediver
21-06-2009, 18:28
Ivor,
Just for you mate.
495494955049551
Enjoy!
Regards
Charles
Thank you for your kindness Charles
I recall doing a "plug change" on those and if my memory serves me correctly there are 36 plugs per Engine
Regards Ivor
Ivor,
I think you are correct. What an aircraft!
Your welcome , anytime!
Regards
Charles
ivorthediver
28-06-2009, 18:12
Excellent photographs Kev , and unusual hanger design
Not hangars as such just sunshades to stop the aircraft becoming too hot to touch.
ivorthediver
28-06-2009, 19:51
Not hangars as such just sunshades to stop the aircraft becoming too hot to touch.
Thank you Kev,looks quite a complex design
harry.gibbon
28-06-2009, 19:53
Not hangars as such just sunshades to stop the aircraft becoming too hot to touch.
some blast wall though Kev!!!!!!!
They were an absolute necessity out there, without them the airframes would heat up to an alarming extent and worries about ammunition cooking off would rear their ugly head.
Only the last three were taken by me.
As to the blast wall, the aicraft could be armed with quite a war load in there and the rest of the airfield does need to be protected in case something nasty happens. You will notice no such precautions around the Tornado GR-4 as the fusing systems on UK weapons are rather more extensive.
ivorthediver
28-06-2009, 20:14
They were an absolute necessity out there, without them the airframes would heat up to an alarming extent and worries about ammunition cooking off would rear their ugly head.
Only the last three were taken by me.
What was the local Kev?
They are Qatar where the mid afternoon temps could reach 54 degrees celcius in the shade.
We actually cooked food on the wing of our landrover.
ivorthediver
28-06-2009, 20:22
They are Qatar where the mid afternoon temps could reach 54 degrees celcius in the shade.
We actually cooked food on the wing of our landrover.
Yes Know I can see what you meand about the heat :(
The comments on this jet aircraft theme have brought back memories of my time in the early 1970's at Boscombe Down with the Martel Missile Trials Team, and our use of ex RN Buccaneer and Sea Vixen aircraft. These were an added attraction to the assorted RAF types on A&AEE strength at the time and were quite spectacular in their own way.
Although Martel was primarily intended as a Buccaneer weapon, 17 of the 25 test firings were launched from Sea Vixen aircraft with 8 in the latter stages of the trial from a suitably modified Buccaneer S2.
All test missile firings took place in Aberporth Bay in Wales where the target was a 60ft raft supporting a 20ft squaresided triangular structure with a centrally positioned 10ft 'bullseye' on each of the 3 sides. For realism however, the old HMS Venus was also used as a target.
Pinpoint accuracy was regularly achieved by our experienced aircrew but disappointingly my own personal attempt at hitting a target (a big black barn near the Devon/Somerset border) from our Ground Trainer resulted in the simulated destruction of Exeter Cathedral!! Definitely not my finest hour!
ivorthediver
06-07-2009, 17:15
The comments on this jet aircraft theme have brought back memories of my time in the early 1970's at Boscombe Down with the Martel Missile Trials Team, and our use of ex RN Buccaneer and Sea Vixen aircraft. These were an added attraction to the assorted RAF types on A&AEE strength at the time and were quite spectacular in their own way.
Although Martel was primarily intended as a Buccaneer weapon, 17 of the 25 test firings were launched from Sea Vixen aircraft with 8 in the latter stages of the trial from a suitably modified Buccaneer S2.
All test missile firings took place in Aberporth Bay in Wales where the target was a 60ft raft supporting a 20ft squaresided triangular structure with a centrally positioned 10ft 'bullseye' on each of the 3 sides. For realism however, the old HMS Venus was also used as a target.
Pinpoint accuracy was regularly achieved by our experienced aircrew but disappointingly my own personal attempt at hitting a target (a big black barn near the Devon/Somerset border) from our Ground Trainer resulted in the simulated destruction of Exeter Cathedral!! Definitely not my finest hour!
We all have our off days mate:(
Vegaskip
06-07-2009, 18:40
Excellent photographs Kev , and unusual hanger design
Talking about 'Hangers' Does any one know why they are called Hangers?.
Gulpers for the first correct answere
astraltrader
06-07-2009, 22:22
Something to do about the word coming from the French for a cattle shed.
When Bleriot crashed his plane before a cross-channel flight in 1909 or something, it was stashed damaged in a cattle-shed. When he subsequently ordered one for an aircraft he referred to it as a metal "hangar" or cattle shed!
astraltrader
07-07-2009, 13:30
Well do I get my gulpers or not?
Dunno why I bother sometimes!!
Vegaskip
07-07-2009, 15:49
Dont be greedy, someone else might want a go, I can tell you that is not the answer I have , any way my tea's ready ,so I'll come back on later when I post the next pic.
Here's a bit I nicked of the first website I found.........
I am looking for the origin of the word hangar. I have heard that it comes from a French aviator who used a building to store blimps and his name was Hangar. I've also heard that it arose because some early airplanes were hung on cables inside a storage building. Any light you could shed on this matter would be most appreciated.
Etymologists agree that English obtained the word from French hangar in the mid-19th century. The venerable OED (Oxford English Dictionary) claims that the etymology beyond that is uncertain, yet the ever-resourceful Mike and Melanie have found some plausible explanations. One possible source of the French form is Medieval Latin angarium "a shed in which horses are shod". Does that shed any light on the issue? Angarium comes ultimately from ungus "fingernail", via ungulus "hoof", from which we get the word ungulate, among others.
Then there's a Middle French version of the word, hanghart, which may very well be an alteration of Middle Dutch *ham-gaerd or *haim-gard, both being the equivalents of English hamlet + garden and referring to a group of buildings enclosed by a fence (gard is cognate with English yard and garden). However, the asterisks before the Middle Dutch words indicate that they are theoretical words and are not documented in written form. Nevertheless, they are logical formations and could very well be the ultimate source of hangar.
The English form of the word first applied to sheds which were used to house coaches, and it is easy to see how that sense could have developed from either ungarium or *ham-gaerd, and further how it could have later taken on the sense "shed or building for storing aircraft". We cannot discount the possibility that "hanging" had some impact on the use of this word in aviation, but we can say with certainty that no one named Hangar has anything to do with this word's history
Vegaskip
07-07-2009, 17:37
KC I think you win. I certainly did'nt delve as deep as you. I have a book called 'Battle Bags'-British airships of the first world war. by CES MOWTHORPE,(If you'r into Airships this is the book). In it he talks about aeroplane sheds and specialy built Airship Sheds and it was in these that airships were housed, they were secured to the roof so that they could be 'deflated', and says' incidentaly this is the derivation of the term 'Hanger'. I could be wrong,but he is supposed to be top man on airships.
Just Few more,
506045060550606
Regards
Charles
ivorthediver
07-07-2009, 19:10
Just Few more,
506045060550606
Regards
Charles
Really stirring the grey cell know Charles ..... Many Thanks for those
astraltrader
07-07-2009, 19:11
Sorry Jim and Kc - but I dont agree with your version! I read that bit about Bleriot in a book ages ago and after searching the net have also found this definition from "answers"
In 1909, Louis Bleriot (http://www.worldnavalships.com/topic/louis-bl-riot-2) crash-landed on a northern French farm in Les Baraques (between Sangatte (http://www.worldnavalships.com/topic/sangatte) and Calais (http://www.worldnavalships.com/topic/calais)) and rolled his monoplane (http://www.worldnavalships.com/topic/monoplane) into the farmer's cattle pen. At the time, Bleriot was in a race to be the first man to cross the English Channel (http://www.worldnavalships.com/topic/english-channel) in a heavier-than-air (http://www.worldnavalships.com/topic/aircraft) aircraft, so he set up headquarters in the unused shed. After returning home, Bleriot called REIDsteel, the maker of the cattle pen, and ordered three "hangars" for personal use. REIDsteel continues to make hangars and hangar parts. The word hangar comes from a northern French (http://www.worldnavalships.com/topic/french-language) dialect, and means "cattle pen (http://www.worldnavalships.com/topic/pen-enclosure)."
So with due respect I do think that I was right!
Vegaskip
07-07-2009, 19:26
See you at Tot time
astraltrader
07-07-2009, 21:35
Cheers Jim - bit of a rum question anyway!:p
Vegaskip
07-07-2009, 21:41
I'm still not convinced, I think it's just an other dastardly French plot to infiltrate our poor battered about language. ( and no I can't speak Gaelic)
Vegaskip
07-07-2009, 21:56
I'll give you another question and this time an answer as well . "how come this Wafu, has'nt posted photos of Jet Aircraft?"...cause he was too busy playing with the bl**dy things.
astraltrader
07-07-2009, 23:59
Well seeing that I started off this thread with some of my own Lightning photographs - it looks like time to add a few more!
1. Lightning F1 from 226 SQDN
2. Lightning F2 from 19 SQDN
3. Lightning F6 from 5 SQDN
4. Lightning F2Afrom 92 SQDN
5. Lightning F1A.
6. Lightning F6.
astraltrader
08-07-2009, 00:21
Followed by a lovely photo of a Meteor and an Indian Navy Seahawk.:)
ivorthediver
08-07-2009, 04:33
Bring em on Terry
astraltrader
08-07-2009, 15:51
Thanks Ivor. Later on today I will scan in some more real photographs of these jets from the 1960`s and 1970`s.
astraltrader
08-07-2009, 22:43
Four fine old photographs of another of my favourite "early British jets"
The Vulcan!!
harry.gibbon
08-07-2009, 23:06
Aaah the lovely Vulcan ,,, hope they can keep the one at Bruntingsthorpe flying !!! and the memories when on a course at RAF base in Englands' smallest county of Rutland.... and these beasts flying all hours out of Cottesmore!!!
The noise however was surpassed when Phanthoms took over from same base
Little h
astraltrader
09-07-2009, 00:33
Then of course there were the beautiful looking Valiant and Victor - the other two aircraft that originally made up our much vaunted "V-force"
astraltrader
09-07-2009, 00:36
If any member has real photographs like these, of any of the early British Jets, then I would really love to see them.:)
ivorthediver
09-07-2009, 04:29
Then of course there were the beautiful looking Valiant and Victor - the other two aircraft that originally made up our much vaunted "V-force"
I remember these ladies being based at Marham Norfolk as Sgn 57 Refueller's
and their is one at Duxford I used to work on
Right, altogether now, all say 'ah' for Terry....................!!!
Mik
ivorthediver
09-07-2009, 20:10
Terry when I worked at Duxford for 12 years helping to restore aircraft we Had some serving members of the RAF who were on there last 12months service pending there end of service and we managed to "Acquire" a gpu[ ground power unit ] and then once we also acquired the fuel we used to run up the electrics on board the aircraft[ after the u/c and engine ignition circuits were issolated ] and cause a lot of interest with the public at weekends when we used to have the nav lights and control surfaces and bomb bay doors moving.[I stress this was supervised by a serving Vulcan crew chief ]
We often got the inquisitive yank and ja*****e photographer asking when the aircraft was going up as we used to do this on the Vulcan and the Victor to which we replied that we were awaiting fuel for engine run ups ;)
Sadley after a while we were rumbled and fuel was withdrawn
astraltrader
09-07-2009, 21:55
Sounds like wonderful days Ivor.
Did you not manage to get any interesting photos when you were at Duxford??
Here's one for the RAF guy's,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jCbzOQwJfd4
Well worth the look.
Regards
Charles
Here is another cool RAF at Goose Air Force Base.
http://www.pinetreeline.org/misc/other/misc16f.html
Fine shot's of the Victor,Vailant,Vulcan bombers.
Regards
Charles
ivorthediver
10-07-2009, 04:31
Here's one for the RAF guy's,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jCbzOQwJfd4
Well worth the look.
Regards
Charles
Thanks Charles very good and brings back memories as my brother worked on all three as an Air Radar technician when he was stationed in east anglia
Terry sorry very few as they were lost when my computor crashed after getting an unfriendly virus last December :mad:
Ivor,
Hopefully they were some good memories. It's interesting to read some of the history's of the unit's.
Regards
Charles
harry.gibbon
18-07-2009, 17:05
Thought a nice topical link might be in order:-
http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/2009/07/18/329826/riat-vulcan-xh558-arrives-for-weekend-display.html
Plus a couple of extra clicks on links within this link and a video etc
Little h
ivorthediver
18-07-2009, 18:55
Thought a nice topical link might be in order:-
http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/2009/07/18/329826/riat-vulcan-xh558-arrives-for-weekend-display.html
Plus a couple of extra clicks on links within this link and a video etc
Little h
Well done harry ....very interesting reading
Here is something from the past. The link is to an article on the Horton HO2-29, which was one of Germany's secret weapons under development recently built from the original aircraft used as a pattern.
http://living.oneindia.in/automobiles/auto-news/
It is amazing how 65 yr old design still has a place in modern aircraft arena.
Well worth the look
here's some modern jets i took pictures of at the leuchars air show last year. hope they aren't to modern for this thread and i've included my all time favourite the F4 Phantom.:)
ivorthediver
23-07-2009, 19:31
Charles / Terry have either of you seen the book LIGHTNING by Ian black published by Airlife I had forgotten that my son had bought this for me many years ago and came across it last weekend......brilliant photographs in there.
Regards Ivor
astraltrader
23-07-2009, 19:39
Tis a brilliant book Ivor! Has great colour photographs.
ivorthediver
23-07-2009, 19:48
Yes I suspected that of all people you would have a copy Terry.......
The picture looking like dead insects...is heart breaking for any one who liked them
Regards Ivor
astraltrader
23-07-2009, 22:00
I will have to dig out my copy to comment on what you say Ivor.
Like you I haven`t looked at it for a while!!
harry.gibbon
26-07-2009, 18:03
Just been on the regional NW news a pic of the Vulcan going overhead at the show!!!
http://www.windermereairshow.co.uk/air-display/XH558-Avro-Vulcan-Bomber/
If there is a vid of it I'll post that as well
Little h
Ivor,
I have not seen the book, but will be keen to purchase it when I see the book.
Regards
Charles
Little h,
Thanks for the link. It is a good thing to see one of the V-force flying again, the memories she must bring back! I have alse heard there is a Victor bomber that is in fast taxi condition, but no word as to wether or not she will made airworthy for the air show circuit.
Regards
Charles
Here is a video of the Victor Bomber LX231.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fIUnDjxy-Yg
Regards
Charles
astraltrader
27-07-2009, 00:33
Charles talking about the only one left able to achieve fast taxi speed [there are three or four others in the UK-essentially complete but in museums,etc] there is this funny story that happened to it recently.
On the 3 May 2009 during a "fast taxi" run at Bruntingthorpe, XM715 made an unplanned brief flight, reaching a height of between 20-30ft before being landed.
The problem is that the aircraft does not have a permit to fly!!
The causes of this incident have not yet been made public, however the CAA have since stated that they will not be conducting an investigation.
The causes have been indentified as the co-pilot failing to reply to the command 'throttles back', thus resulting in the pilot having to control the throttles himself, equalling in a brief loss of control of the aircraft, causing it to rise. No injuries to the aircraft were sustained apart from severely heated brakes.
ivorthediver
27-07-2009, 05:09
Here is a video of the Victor Bomber LX231.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fIUnDjxy-Yg
Regards
Charles
Thank you Charles that certainly brings back some memories .
Did you ever get the chance to go inside the Crew pod ?
As you climbed up the ladder you were presented with three rear facing seats for various crew members at which point you had to turn through 180 and climb a few more steps to get into the Pilot / Co Pilot seats.
Regards Ivor
ivorthediver
27-07-2009, 05:11
Just been on the regional NW news a pic of the Vulcan going overhead at the show!!!
http://www.windermereairshow.co.uk/air-display/XH558-Avro-Vulcan-Bomber/
If there is a vid of it I'll post that as well
Little h
Thank you Harry , love to see it again
Regards Ivor
Terry,
That would be quite the shock during a fast taxi to find yourself airborne! I'm glad the CAA decided not to investigate. You think the pilot decided on another co-pilot?
Great story Terry!
Regards
Charles
Ivor,
No i have not but, I would NOT pass up the chance to do so! I think there is one here in the colonies somewhere.
Regards
Charles
harry.gibbon
27-07-2009, 21:33
Thank you Charles that certainly brings back some memories .
Did you ever get the chance to go inside the Crew pod ?
As you climbed up the ladder you were presented with three rear facing seats for various crew members at which point you had to turn through 180 and climb a few more steps to get into the Pilot / Co Pilot seats.
Regards Ivor
Yep went in the static one they had at Blackpool Airport years ago.... before it rotted and had to be taken away.
ivorthediver
28-07-2009, 04:56
Yep went in the static one they had at Blackpool Airport years ago.... before it rotted and had to be taken away.
Claustrophobic.... or what Harry..Imagine having all your gear on and sitting in there mate ........could not swing a flea around .......never mind a cat
Regars Ivor
Congratulation's Harry !
Here is a video on the RAF's early Jets part 1 of 7.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W0eTSKpCc74&feature=related
Worth a look!
Regards
Charles
harry.gibbon
28-07-2009, 19:24
Claustrophobic.... or what Harry..Imagine having all your gear on and sitting in there mate ........could not swing a flea around .......never mind a cat
Regars Ivor
Congratulation's Harry !
Thanks for congrats!!!
the conditions were very akin to some operating positions in the Diesel Electric S/M's of various classes
warshipdisposal
07-08-2009, 11:55
I wonder if anyone can help....im seeking a picture or photo of sea harrier (SHAR ) XZ438... it was one of the early ones...many thanks in advance
steve
Re CGRets post at 104 and the Horton HO2-29 - there is a prog on either the Discovery or Nat Geo channel showing on Sky in the UK at the present time called 'Hitler's Stealth Fighter' which is all about this remarkable aircraft. It is well worth watching and is very informative. I'll leave my review at that so as not to spoil the prog for anyone who watches it
Mik
Mik,
Thanks ever so much for the hints on the program. Will try to see if available in the US.
Regards
Charles
astraltrader
09-08-2009, 03:09
I will echo Miks comments on the programme - well worth watching!
Coming across the excellent photographs from CGRET in post 18, especially the picture of the impressive F104 Starfighter, reminded me of a day in the 1970's at RAF St Mawgan, when two German Air Force Starfighters arrived for a few days' visit. After parking up, both pilots reported to Operations Wing HQ's where I worked. Following completion of all necessary arrival procedures and a quick change of clothing, we walked together to the on-camp bus stop to catch the five minutes past five double decker bus to Newquay.
As we plodded through the narrow Cornish lanes at a steady 25mph I couldn't help thinking, with amusement, of the contrasting modes of transport my two new friends had experienced in just a few short hours. From the quicksilver Luftwaffe 104 to the dull green Western National 505! Happy days!
Regards .....Paul
Charles
It is the Nat Geo channel for the HO 229 prog
Mik
astraltrader
12-08-2009, 01:38
I have just found this photograph which I have had for years.
It is a rare shot of De Havilland Vampire T11`s taken at Exeter Airport sometime during 1962.
As well as the two in the foreground you can, if you look carefully, discern two more taking off behind them.
They were part of 3/4 Civilian Anti-Aircraft Co-operation Unit managed by Exeter Airport Ltd, which at the time also included half a dozen or so Meteor TT20`s.
For those wishing to know more about this Unit - it commenced with No.3 Civilian Anti-Aircraft Co-operation Unit managed by Exeter Airport Ltd, which established itself at the airport for over 20 years, and provided target facilities for guns based in the West Country.
The unit became 3 / 4 CAACU when it amalgamated with 4 CAACU at Llandow during August 1954. Equipped with Beaufighter TT.10s, Mosquito TT.35s and Spitfire F.21s & LF.16Es, it was primarily engaged in target towing for all three services, and as faster aircraft became available they replaced the earlier types.
De Havilland Vampire FB.5s were introduced in the 1950s to become the unit's first jets, and for many years target towing Meteors TT.20s were used. Other types used for tactical exercises included the Boulton Paul Balliol and the Chipmunk.
More Vampire FB.5s arrived at Exeter with the disbandment of the Royal Auxiliary Air Force on 10 March 1957. Their replacement came in the form of the Vampire T.11, and during the 1960s Hawker Hunter F.4s and Jet Provosts were also used.
In 1968, the Meteors were replaced with Canberras each towing a pair of Rushton targets fitted with flares.
Eventually on 31 December 1971, the unit’s duties were taken over by the newly reformed 7 Squadron equipped with Canberra TT.18s at St Mawgan and the unit finally disbanded, having been one of Exeter’s longest residents of all time.
On a smaller scale, the stay of Chipmunks from No.4 Air Experience Flight was longer, from the unit’s formation in September 1958 to its disbandment in December 1995.
I was fortunate to be given a couple of quite long flights in their Chipmunks in 1967 when as a 15 year old pupil of Exeter School and a member of the ATC, I was allowed to take over the controls for about 15 minutes in each flight. A tremendous experience!
astraltrader
12-08-2009, 22:43
Fair enough I was going to hunt for a photo I have of a Meteor from the same period at Exeter, but as nobody seems to be interested it will save me all the hassle! :)
Paul,
It's amazing how the Luftwaffe maintain a safety record the USAF could not. As was said at the time "Missile with a man it".
Mik,
Thank You for information.
Terry,
Great backround on the Vampire and Moteor. Will wait to see your your postings.
Regards
Charles
No 3 CAACU
Terry, contrary to you comment in post 130, I for one, was very interested in the picture of the Vampire at 3 CAACU, as I'm sure that photos of this type are not very common. Thank you.
I do have a personal interest in the subject as during the early 1960's I was part of HQ's 25 Group at RAF White Waltham which then exercised administrative control of 3 CAACU at Exeter and 5 CAACU at RAF Woodvale. The Air Vice Marshal commanding the Group was also responsible for 18 University Air Squadrons and 3 or 4 RAF Pilot and Navigation Schools across the country.
Coincidentally, at that time, the Air Officer Commanding HQ Air Cadets was also based at White Waltham which was then a busy little station. Sadly all good things come to an end, and the RAF withdrew from the airfield in 1967, and I ended up in Aden!
Regards ...... Paul
astraltrader
13-08-2009, 00:10
Fair enough Paul and Charles I will have a root for it!
It was taken at the 1965 Exeter airshow from memory!
Once I have found it I will post it in this thread.
Vegaskip
13-08-2009, 09:44
I have just found this photograph which I have had for years.
It is a rare shot of De Havilland Vampire T11`s taken at Exeter Airport sometime during 1962.
As well as the two in the foreground you can, if you look carefully, discern two more taking off behind them.
They were part of 3/4 Civilian Anti-Aircraft Co-operation Unit managed by Exeter Airport Ltd, which at the time also included half a dozen or so Meteor TT20`s.
For those wishing to know more about this Unit - it commenced with No.3 Civilian Anti-Aircraft Co-operation Unit managed by Exeter Airport Ltd, which established itself at the airport for over 20 years, and provided target facilities for guns based in the West Country.
The unit became 3 / 4 CAACU when it amalgamated with 4 CAACU at Llandow during August 1954. Equipped with Beaufighter TT.10s, Mosquito TT.35s and Spitfire F.21s & LF.16Es, it was primarily engaged in target towing for all three services, and as faster aircraft became available they replaced the earlier types.
De Havilland Vampire FB.5s were introduced in the 1950s to become the unit's first jets, and for many years target towing Meteors TT.20s were used. Other types used for tactical exercises included the Boulton Paul Balliol and the Chipmunk.
More Vampire FB.5s arrived at Exeter with the disbandment of the Royal Auxiliary Air Force on 10 March 1957. Their replacement came in the form of the Vampire T.11, and during the 1960s Hawker Hunter F.4s and Jet Provosts were also used.
In 1968, the Meteors were replaced with Canberras each towing a pair of Rushton targets fitted with flares.
Eventually on 31 December 1971, the unit’s duties were taken over by the newly reformed 7 Squadron equipped with Canberra TT.18s at St Mawgan and the unit finally disbanded, having been one of Exeter’s longest residents of all time.
On a smaller scale, the stay of Chipmunks from No.4 Air Experience Flight was longer, from the unit’s formation in September 1958 to its disbandment in December 1995.
I was fortunate to be given a couple of quite long flights in their Chipmunks in 1967 when as a 15 year old pupil of Exeter School and a member of the ATC, I was allowed to take over the controls for about 15 minutes in each flight. A tremendous experience!
Hi Terry, would you mind if I use this photo as the basis of a painting,Not necessary a straight copy, maybe even substituting a couple of Meteors for the two taking off.
regards
astraltrader
13-08-2009, 17:07
Jim you are always welcome to use any picture I post as a basis for one of your marvellous paintings.
Vegaskip
13-08-2009, 17:59
Thanks Terry I'll put it on the paintings thread when done.
Re: RAF withdrawal from White Waltham.
For accuracy purposes a quick return to my post 132 for a small amendment. HQ 25 Group and HQ Air Cadets left in 1968, not in 1967 as I previously stated. Thereafter there was only a small RAF presence on the airfield - the University Of London Air Squadron and No. 6 AEF, both Units staying until the early 1970's.
Historians will know that the airfield was for several years the home of Fairey Aviation which produced, amongst other types, the Fairey Gannet for the Fleet Air Arm and some foreign forces, and the revolutionary but ultimately unsuccesful Fairey Rotodyne. Fairey Air Surveys were co-located with their Dakota aircraft.
A Base fondly remembered by all who served there.
Vegaskip
16-08-2009, 11:51
Taken at Leuchars 2 weeks ago, I think it's a brilliant colour scheme.
53932
Hi every one .....i am out of my comfort zone here ....
But i was looking for any mention /clips of target tow aircraft....
On a site i found ..was this posting ....
As a child i used to watch Canberras target towing for HMS Cambridge's Gunnery School @ Wembury near Plymouth. A fantastic introduction to aviation, I'm sure watching these stripped jets whilst sat in a boat created my original desire to become a pilot in the RAF. (I guess it should have been the FAA!!!)
Does anyone have any photos of these aircraft in action, and does anyone know much about their operation? Where did they fly from (Marham or Wyton back then??)
Yep , and i am still looking .....
All gunnery rates will remember those day,s ,either at CAMBRIDGE, PORTLAND gunnery range ......or when at SINGER,S at the range there.
cylla
cylla
Re: post 139 above.
As the person who wrote the post emphasisis Canberra target towing aircraft, the period in question would be after 1963 when the RAF began using this particular type of aircraft on these duties. The Royal Navy Fleet Requirements Unit (later FRADU), also began using the type from 1969.
As the writer was near HMS Cambridge on the outskirts of Plymouth when recalling seeing these aircraft, it would be either RAF Canberras' From RAF West Raynham in Norfolk or RAF Binbrook in Lincolnshire, or RN FRU Canberras from RNAS Yeovilton. If, however, the period he refers to is after 1970, it is more likely that the Canberra target towers he saw were from No 7 Squadron based at the much closer RAF St Mawgan in Cornwall.
Hi there,
The date i am looking for is from 1965 .....to the early 70,s towing targets.
Powers .., your infomation helps me to cut it down , to which aircraft they were ,
I ws always down in the T.S tracking them on radar .
many thanks
cylla
harry.gibbon
25-09-2009, 21:17
:)Vulcan scheduled for Southport Airshow this weekend:).....
http://www.southportvisiter.co.uk/southport-news/southport-southport-news/2009/09/25/vulcan-will-take-to-skies-at-southport-s-air-show-101022-24773728/
Lets hope for nice weather then:)
harry.gibbon
25-09-2009, 23:28
Re FRADU...
http://www.fradu-hunters.co.uk/canberra/canimage.html
any help???
Might as well have this as well:-
http://www.vectorsite.net/avcanbra_1.html
Little h
astraltrader
25-09-2009, 23:49
Hi every one .....i am out of my comfort zone here ....
But i was looking for any mention /clips of target tow aircraft....
On a site i found ..was this posting ....
As a child i used to watch Canberras target towing for HMS Cambridge's Gunnery School @ Wembury near Plymouth. A fantastic introduction to aviation, I'm sure watching these stripped jets whilst sat in a boat created my original desire to become a pilot in the RAF. (I guess it should have been the FAA!!!)
Does anyone have any photos of these aircraft in action, and does anyone know much about their operation? Where did they fly from (Marham or Wyton back then??)
Yep , and i am still looking .....
All gunnery rates will remember those day,s ,either at CAMBRIDGE, PORTLAND gunnery range ......or when at SINGER,S at the range there.
cylla
cylla
You probably saw it Cylla but I posted a lovely photograph of a Canberra in the first post of this thread...
harry.gibbon
28-09-2009, 13:04
Vulcan at 2009 Southport Airshow weekend just passed.... 5 good films off You Tube
http://video.google.co.uk/videosearch?hl=en&q=vulcan%20bomber%20at%20southport%202009&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wv#
Little h
ivorthediver
28-09-2009, 17:33
Vulcan at 2009 Southport Airshow weekend just passed.... 5 good films off You Tube
http://video.google.co.uk/videosearch?hl=en&q=vulcan%20bomber%20at%20southport%202009&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wv#
Little h
Thanks Harry a real memory stir going on there
Kind regards Ivor
harry.gibbon
04-10-2009, 22:11
and a particular family favourite ... having flown to HK and back in the late 60's and 1972... VC10 ... a good site so here it is:-
http://www.vc10.net/History/RAFVC10s.html
enjoy:)
Little h
ivorthediver
05-10-2009, 19:15
and a particular family favourite ... having flown to HK and back in the late 60's and 1972... VC10 ... a good site so here it is:-
http://www.vc10.net/History/RAFVC10s.html
enjoy:)
Little h
Thanks again Harry, I think they have one at Duxford but would have to check to be sure
Regards Ivor
harry.gibbon
05-10-2009, 19:23
apparently there is still one there according to this 2009 link:-
http://www.damianlappin.com/duxford-air-museum.htm#
Little h
ivorthediver
05-10-2009, 19:35
apparently there is still one there according to this 2009 link:-
http://www.damianlappin.com/duxford-air-museum.htm#
Little h
Yes Harry you are right , as I said I was not sure if there was , as its a while since I was there last.
Ivor
fleetchief
19-10-2009, 02:47
Geepers ha ha, well its about the 60's initt:D
These UK A/C of the period are FANTASTIC!!! I keep coming back to this thread and just enthuse at the quality A/C we produced in this country:).
Javillin, Lightning, Canberra, Buccaneer, TSR2 etc etc nobody on earth could match them, but some did use them (calling them by a different marque) BEFORE putting the boot in and ensuring we never got the upper hand manfucturing wise.
Soddin shame we never had the Politicians with the international clout to overcome this prejudice against our A/C design and manufacture!!!:mad:
Little h
I always thought, aesthetically, what beautiful aircraft the Javelin and the Hawker Hunter were. And to digress to civil aircraft, the DeHavilland Comet. Another aircraft killed by the U.S. because of a couple of early incidence. Though I note that Boeing doesn't have the same problem when their aircraft crash (frequently).
In the early 70's, when it was thought that Guatamala would invade Belize, Eskimo was stationed just off the coast to act as a radar picket for the RAF Harriers and the Army Puma's. I'll never forget the sight and sound as two Harriers came in at wave top height, straight up the stern and at the last second each one turned the aircraft onto its side and they flew past us, with one each side of the ship, their wingtips a few feet above the waves.
Ed
fleetchief
19-10-2009, 02:53
Attached are some photos my old man took at some airshows of the day, probably at Leuchars, and probably in the 70's. There are a couple of non-jets sneaking in - a Shackleton, a Hercules (I think) and even a helicopter, but most are modern jets - Vulcan, Jaguar etc etc. If I remember my aircraft correctly, there is also a DC-10 in there too - I was sat next to one of them while I was a passenger on a Tristar at Brize Norton.
We used to live in Stubbington, which is very near HMS Daedalus, Lee-on-Solent (now closed), and I remember we were out in the garden on the day they had the air show (about 1980). An Avro Vulcan came in on a long low dive, making very little noise (obviously throttled back) and just as he got overhead he opened up the throttles full and went into a climb over the airfield. We could read his numbers underneath, he was that low. And what an incredible noise when he opened up the throttles.
Ed
fleetchief
19-10-2009, 03:11
Vulcan at 2009 Southport Airshow weekend just passed.... 5 good films off You Tube
http://video.google.co.uk/videosearch?hl=en&q=vulcan%20bomber%20at%20southport%202009&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wv#
Little h
An impressive video, and the noise was just what I remembered.
During visits to my sister in Bishampton, Worcs it was always a pleasure to sit in the garden and watch an incredible variety of aircraft flying low overhead, while they were doing "runs" for the Royal Radar Research Establishment at Pershore (about 10 miles away), now sadly closed. The road to Pershore actually cut across the middle of the runway, and one would often sit there, stopped by a sentry, while one of the trail aircraft landed or took off right in front of you.
Ed
fleetchief
19-10-2009, 03:20
and a particular family favourite ... having flown to HK and back in the late 60's and 1972... VC10 ... a good site so here it is:-
http://www.vc10.net/History/RAFVC10s.html
enjoy:)
Little h
When we sent 1/3rd of Eskimo's crew home from Freeport, Bahamas (so they could have leave while the ship returned to UK) we expected the RAF to send one of their usual VC-10's for transport. Much to our surprise they sent their V.I.P. Comet aircraft, normally used for high ranking passengers. Only problem was it did not have a galley to feed a plane full of hungry sailors. It was planned that we would refuel in Gander, Newfoundland and all the food was there. Due to a severe snow storm it was impossible to land at Gander, and we diverted to Sidney, Nova Scotia. I don't think they'd ever seen a 4 engine jet before, and of course they had no food ready. We did clear out the airport cafe of sandwiches and doughnuts to tide us over until we landed at RAF Brize Norton.
Ed
RossWatton
25-10-2009, 12:09
For all fans of Royal Naval aviation - particularly the 'Jet Age'.
Here are some recent paintings I have been working on. Details can be found on my website http://www.navalbroadsides.co.uk
As I'm not likely to get a slot on 'Friday Night with Jonathan Ross' I thought I'd try a bit of promotion here. I hope you don't mind.
As you will see, I have tried to connect a type of aircraft, with a carrier that would have operated them at a particular time; sadly a bygone age.
Regards
Ross
ivorthediver
25-10-2009, 12:16
Very Nice work Ross, and just to show how old I am I have seen all those in the Air so to speak
RossWatton
25-10-2009, 12:36
Thank you Ivor!
With age comes wisdom. You are very fortunate to have seen all these in their hay day.
Regards
Ross
Vegaskip
25-10-2009, 21:20
Great pictures Ross, nice to see how professionals do it.
RossWatton
25-10-2009, 21:32
Thank you for the compliment Jim
astraltrader
10-11-2009, 01:44
A couple of interesting Hunter photographs for you Jet lovers out there!
Firstly the 1953 F3 speed record holder.
Secondly the original P1067 Hunter prototype...
Enjoy! :):)
ivorthediver
10-11-2009, 06:16
Thanks Terry , nice photo's
As has been previously posted, Britain had some excellent aircraft designs immediately after WW2 and the Comet must rank as one of the best. I remember the news report after its first flight packed with journalists. The absence of vibration allowed a reporter to balance a threepenny piece on one of its flat sides on the table in front of his seat and the photo appeared in the next day's paper. Another memory but not the Comet I think, was the introduction of all seats facing 'aft' (towards the tail for landlubbers) as a safety measure. It didn't take on! In 1970, I flew from Sydney to LA with BOAC in a VC10 and its claim to fame was its engines were on the tail making the passenger cabin the quietest in the sky. Sadly the VC10 was knocked off by Boeing when grace and style were overtaken by 'bums on seats' 747s. Although I only ever saw it once flying over Melbourne in 1974, the Concord taking off and landing was a beautiful sight. That plane suffered from the Australian Government decision not to allow flights across Australia because of perceived property damage from the sonic boom. All sounds ridiculous now doesn't it. Rob T
Whilst the paying passengers got forward facing seats on civil aircraft, RAF Transport Command, as it was then, had rear facing seats for their trooping aircraft for many a year
Mik
[QUOTE=jonti;84712]As has been previously posted, Britain had some excellent aircraft designs immediately after WW2 and the Comet must rank as one of the best. Sadly the VC10 was knocked off by Boeing when grace and style were overtaken by 'bums on seats' 747s. Although I only ever saw it once flying over Melbourne in 1974, the Concord taking off and landing was a beautiful sight......
One or two items to debate, with your quote Jonti and a noticeable absence of talk of a very much innovative British Naval Aircraft of great merit by you all.
First off the Comet. Yup, a good aircraft I agree in fact while waiting to look over the Boeing Plant in Seattle back in 1998 we went back to the airfield where a Comet was parked. We cheekily followed a chap in through the side door of a hanger to find an Aladdins cave of all sorts of aircraft bits, it was the Museum of Flights restoration hanger. We asked if we could look around and were made most welcome. Standing covered in cellophane was an aircrafts undercarrage bogey beautifully restored to new condition. A voice from the mezzanine floor asked 'do you know what that is?' Transpired it was from the Comet broken up at Boscombe Down (?) in the Uk and due to be fitted to the Comet parked outside. He was an American and offered to show us inside the Comet outside .... you bet ... so in we we climbed and listened to his desertion on how great the Comet was, triple hydraulics, made to land safely on its belly if the wheels didnt come down, the first bogie undercarrage and much more ... this praise from an American, in a Comet, on Boeing Field !!! If you are ever in Seattle go and look at the magnificent job they have done on her or visit the Museum of Flights web page ...and look for the Comet.... she is probably in the best non flying condition she has ever been in .... and to finish off she was one of two bought by Pan Am as an insurance JUST IN CASE THE BOEING 707 didnt make it !!
However, be that as it may you must realise that the Comet was doomed from the start by the Boeing 707 which was streets ahead of the Comet in all departments, swept wing design, engine pods, number of seats and flying by numbers and range .... a commercial sucess and sold by experts. One thing the British aircraft manufacturers were not good at and their biggest failing was in the sales department.
I helped run 3 airshows here in little Westport in the late 1990's and we had the very last Agricola Top Dresser on show ... its been sold back to the UK now I think. A great aircraft, just what the New Zealand Top dressing companies wanted ... large capacity, great view, terrific flying ability, solid and dependable. BUT, if anyone wanted to fly in it they had to wear clean white overalls. Any modifications or additions queried of the manager and he had to WRITE to England for an answer, not telegraph or phone ...WRITE. There was a distinct lack of urgency, interest or service ....how could the 'Colonials' know anything about aircraft !!! Net result was very few sales anywhere and eventually one aircraft and finally all the factory spares and jigs were bought and shipped to New Zealand.
Now, the one truly innovative and fantastic aircraft distinctly lacking in this debate ... better than all the rest you have discussed except the TSR2 and thats the Buccaneer. Once it had the RR Spey engines it had the power and fuel economy it needed. Apart from the engines its wing design was a masterpiece and the heart of the aircrafts performance. The wings were small enough and built with the strength to live in the very, very tough stress environment of very fast wave top flying to get under the enemy's radar yet, with the blown wing creating the lift required to fly at the slow speed needed to land on the small space of an aircraft carrier. Notice in all the landing photos video's the petals of the huge tail airbrakes are open .... they cause an enormous amount of drag to allow the engines to be powered up without increasing speed to produce the 'Huff' needed to blow the wings and allow the very small wings to create the lift need for the aircraft to stay airborne..... very clever. Another notable detail is the rotating bomb bay.....cuts down drag, also the pinched body or 'Coke bottle' design of the 'Area Rule' which again, like the bulbous bow on a ship reduces drag.....Of course the RAF absolutely hated her, no way would they have such an aircraft ..... BUT, in the end they had to have them when the Aircraft carriers were done away with and the entire fleet of Naval Buccs were thrust upon them. They then found out what a fantasic aircraft it was and ordered a whole lot more, folding wings and arrestor hooks complete ..... they also beat the Yanks when they went over there for an excercise. The Yanks fell about all over themselves at the sight of these plumb old battered ladies ... another turkey shoot. However for a few days the Buccs delivered the bombs without the Yanks finding out how they arrived at the target, the latest F .... whatever just never picked them up .... until a Bucc got lost and had to pop up OUT OF THE RAVINE to see where they were .... bingo they spotted him. The Yanks were astounded that an aircraft could fly at that speed and so low down without falling to bits that their super doopa radars could not spot them ........ I could go on but read all about her.
The British Aircraft Industry in the 50's was so divided and full of belief that they were superior they were doomed to fall. They should have taken note during the war .... as an example, when the license to build RR Merlin engine was given to the Americans they took one look at the plans and said no way could they manufacture to the RR tolerances. Each British Merlin was 'FITTED' together by a skilled workman..... it required a specialised tool kit to maintain it and because of it being 'fitted together' according to the skill of the man who made it it leaked oil. The Packard RR Merlin, which is the main Merlin we see flying today is a totally different kettle of fish. Packard made each part to such an exact tolerance that you could take one bit from a bin of many of the same and select its corresponding part from many in another bin and they fitted together perfectly.... no hand fitting required. To service a Packard Merlin you basically ( and I know its over simplifying ) needed an adjustable spanner and a screwdriver. The Canadian Lancasters were flown to England and had Packard Merlins of course. On landing the ERKS were astounded that they bore no sign of oil leaks and the oil sumps were still full.....Packard Merlins did not leak oil !! Same with the 'Japanese' cars of today ... they do not leak oil over the garage floor.
Sorry folks .... but them's some of the realities ..... other people do think outside of the square, see how to do things differently and in a lot of circumstances better than the British way I am sorry to have to admit.
steve roberts
24-05-2010, 09:25
Hi David.Very good post mate.Talking about the Buccaneer,I remember years ago seeing a film taken on a US Air Force bombing range(Complete with sound track) It was amazing,the thing was weaving in and out between power pylons and the poor old yanks could be heard commenting,"It's gonna crash". Of course it never did and a stunned silence feel on the sound track!
Many Regards Steve.
harry.gibbon
24-05-2010, 10:21
Oh dear me, David;
Reading your post and reflecting some home-truths can kinda hurt you know:o Puny politicians and ineffective sales people certainly contributed.
I think your point about the facets of the Buccaneer not having got an airing on here seems to arise out of the A/C being referred to around the various threads. I know I have alluded to the following extract on a previous occasion but can't find it in the search facility (as yet) so I shall repeat it here ... what a description!!!!
'The mighty Buccaneer was an aircraft apparently forged from solid steel by the gods themselves'
taken from http://www.thunder-and-lightnings.co.uk/buccaneer/index.php
one of very many good offerings available on the web.
Little h
Gee Steve that was a quick reply and has made me BLUSH [COLOR="Blue"]!!!!
That must have been the excercise I quoted .... Red Flag in the mid 1970's !!! the Yanks aircraft was the then brand new F-15. A no contest really? but it wasn't so and a big reality check for the Americans.
Must try and see if its on You Tube...
Thanks mate....er, sorry ... Sir !!
harry.gibbon
06-06-2010, 19:13
SAAF English Electric (BAC) - Lightnings in flight
Shown this afternoon on BBC2 TV
For those who can get it, either a repeat or on iPlayer BBC2 a programme entitled; 'Earth, the power of the Planet' 2 of a 5 part series. Dr. Iain Stewart hitches a ride in a two seater with a photo chase plane for company and soars to 45,000 feet'ish.
Aaaah the take off and that near vertical climb etc etc.
Little h
astraltrader
06-06-2010, 20:14
A brilliant plane and a brilliant programme. The Lightning was always one of my favourite aircraft [see pictures in post #1 and #86 in this thread].
Ah, the Lightning! What an aircraft.
I remember a story circulating at the time about some UK/US exercises in which a U2 spy plane (allegedly the highest flying aircraft) was intercepted by a Lightning diving onto it, much to the consternation of the USAF.
I don't know if its true, but it's a good story and deserves to be.
harry.gibbon
06-06-2010, 21:59
Ah, the Lightning! What an aircraft.
I remember a story circulating at the time about some UK/US exercises in which a U2 spy plane (allegedly the highest flying aircraft) was intercepted by a Lightning diving onto it, much to the consternation of the USAF.
I don't know if its true, but it's a good story and deserves to be.
Well now, here is the story, not a million miles away from yours; it appears like this....
------------
In one NATO exercise with British Airways cooperation, F-15s, F-16s, F-14s, Mirages, F-104s and Lightnings were all tasked with catching Concorde in a stern intercept, only the Lightning managed to catch and overtake her! During another NATO exercise during 1984, Flt. Lt. Mike Hale intercepted an American Lockheed U-2 spy-plane at a height which it's pilot had believed was beyond interception, 88,000 ft (26 800 m), Mike Hale was flying a twenty two year old (1962) F3 specification English Electric Lightning!
------------
... taken from this site:-
http://www.military-aircraft.org.uk/jet-fighter-planes/english-electric-lightning.htm
Note:- a more detailed recount of the intercept can be found on Wiki by typing in English Electric Lightining ... its the 4th and 5th para's under sub-heading 'climb'. A/C number is included as XR749.
Little h
MelQuick
07-06-2010, 05:40
The Javelin was one of the noisiest aircraft the RAF had, even while taxying. At RAF Tengah, in Singapore, Nos 60 and 64 Squadrons had Javelin FAW9s and they would send up a dawn patrol of two aircraft each morning. As they taxyed past the domestic site, everyone was awake early for breakfast.
Javelins were prone to catching fire on start. One groundcrew member won a commendation when a small fire broke out on engine start. He removed his shorts and used them to beat the fire out!
Mel
harry.gibbon
07-06-2010, 07:54
The Javelin was one of the noisiest aircraft the RAF had, even while taxying. At RAF Tengah, in Singapore, Nos 60 and 64 Squadrons had Javelin FAW9s and they would send up a dawn patrol of two aircraft each morning. As they taxyed past the domestic site, everyone was awake early for breakfast.
Javelins were prone to catching fire on start. One groundcrew member won a commendation when a small fire broke out on engine start. He removed his shorts and used them to beat the fire out!
Mel
They often flew as singletons or in formation over our estate at Seletar Hills, nice looking a/c though.
Little h
Thanks for the Lightning information Harry. I am glad the story is true, as I first heard it about twenty tears ago, and was impressed at the time.
INVINCIBLE
11-06-2010, 15:57
A couple of rather scenic shots of US Navy jets, giving a good impression of speed.
Peter Colston
11-06-2010, 19:20
Here's a good link about Scimitars:
http://www.thunder-and-lightnings.co.uk/scimitar/history.html
and a quote for those who lack time to read the whole thing:
The Scimitar was, at the time of its introduction, the heaviest and most powerful aircraft ever to serve in the Fleet Air Arm. While innovations such as angled decks helped, the situation with these large and fast aircraft and small aircraft carriers meant that take-offs and landings were an increasingly dangerous business. While the Americans simply built bigger carriers, this luxury was not available to the RN, which was becoming increasingly pressurised to save money, not spend it. The Scimitar's design included a tail bumper so that the aircraft could be rested on it for take-off, with the nosewheel high in the air, actually off the deck. The increased angle of attack meant the less powerful catapults on the RN's small carriers could still manage to bring a heavy (and heavily loaded) aircraft like the Scimitar to flying speed.
Accidents began to mount up - in-flight fires, landing accidents by the dozen, ditchings and plain old crashes. The general consensus these days is that the RN was simply not experienced enough in operating such an advanced and heavy aircraft. The limited size of the carriers also meant that landing accidents became far more serious than they would otherwise have been. In all, 76 Scimitars were actually produced (the last batch of 24 having been cancelled), and no less than 39 were lost in a variety of accidents - an attrition rate of over 51% over the Scimitar's service life!
Perhaps someone can tell us whether such an appalling attrition rate has ever been exceeded by any other carrier-based aircraft type. Remember that this was in peace-time. 50 years on it is hard to imagine the Navy accepting such losses - or perhaps more importantly these days the Treasury!
Commodore, try the Westland Wyvern a turboprop when 813 and 817 sqaudrons were on board HMS Eagle 1955 we lost all of both squadrons aircraft and the replacements not to mention some of the pilots!!
astraltrader
11-06-2010, 21:14
Commodore Armiger has not posted in the forum for a while now.
bob shayler
12-06-2010, 05:22
We used to live in Stubbington, which is very near HMS Daedalus, Lee-on-Solent (now closed), and I remember we were out in the garden on the day they had the air show (about 1980). An Avro Vulcan came in on a long low dive, making very little noise (obviously throttled back) and just as he got overhead he opened up the throttles full and went into a climb over the airfield. We could read his numbers underneath, he was that low. And what an incredible noise when he opened up the throttles.
Ed
Hi Ed,
I took this photo on the day you mention. Sorry it's a little blurry, I wasn't going to post it at all but couldn't resist it in the end,
regards,
Bob
80131
MelQuick
12-06-2010, 05:55
A couple of rather scenic shots of US Navy jets, giving a good impression of speed.
Terrific pics. The aircraft are Grumman F11F-1 Tigers.
Mel
harry.gibbon
12-06-2010, 18:44
RAF Sentinel R1/ASTOR
Following on from the flypast today, here are some details of this aircraft, which until seeing it on TV today I have never knowingly seen in flight. Thanks to Dreadnought (Clive) on a different thread, for his heads-up on participating aircraft.
____________________________________
At almost £1bn for five, the Sentinel R1 jet does not come cheap, but the Ministry of Defence (MoD) hopes its latest "eye in the sky" will have a real impact. The twin-engined plane carries some of the world's most sophisticated radar equipment, allowing it to detect and track enemy movement over huge areas.
The Airborne Stand-Off Radar (Astor) can cover thousands of square miles, looking deep into valleys, picking out well-used enemy routes and mapping vehicle activity. Information is relayed to ground stations within seconds of the images being captured, allowing troops below to react at speed to tactical planning.
---------------
Extracts from BBC NEWS UK CHANNEL article 11/2/2009.
Link to full piece which includes a 1.43min video on the a/c towards end of the article is here:-
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7881031.stm
____________________________________
Two further links; the first from Times Online 15/2/2009 identifying shortcomings in crew numbers trained (note the date):-
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article5734089.ece
the second and more recent from Flightglobal site with a Flight International item dated 23/3/1010, Sentinel article is mid way throught the piece:-
http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/2010/03/23/339632/raf-heralds-emergence-of-combat-istar-over-afghanistan.html
_____________________________________
1st pic Source Mod and is as included in the first link
2nd pic is of the mobile ground equipment used to receive data from a/c
Little h
harry.gibbon
06-10-2010, 23:16
BAC Lightning...
Currently viewing BBC 2 TV, Prog entitled Wonders of the Solar System part 3 of 5 in the series.
Prof Brian Cox just had a fantastic ride in a Lightning up to 60k to have a shufti look see at the 'atmosphere'.
Point of this posting is to advise that if anybody gets a chance to see this series repeated, then look out for this episode, because there is footage of a near vertical climb out of take-off .... pure magic!!!!
Little h
harry.gibbon
30-01-2011, 01:33
Two of our friends, Ark Royal and Buccaneer; have a 'butchers hook' (look) at this then, to stir up the need for fixed wing carriers... extracts from a site linked below:-
_______________
Extract:-
This time the Royal Navy had a task force with aircraft carrier HMS Ark Royal deployed in the western Atlantic, bound for the Virginia Capes, and carrying Hawker Siddeley S.Mk.1 Buccaneer fighter-bombers of the Naval Air Squadron 809 as well as McDonnell Douglas F-4K Phantom IIs of the NAS.892. Fresh from repairs after a collision with Soviet Kotlin-class destroyer, in the Mediterranean in late 1971, the ship – supported by two supply-vessels, RFA Olmeda and RFA Regent – was ordered to flank speed on 26 January. On the following morning, a Fairey Gannet AEW-aircraft was sent to Bermuda to collect documents relating to the situation in British Honduras, and on 28 January two Buccaneers were sent for a 4.000km round-trip over the colony. Despite the length of their mission and the fact that they had only ten minutes of fuel over the crisis area, the two fighter-bombers – supported by two Buccaneers equipped as tankers on the way out and two on the way in – were enough for the Guatemalans to get the message: if they invaded, they would be facing a powerful air group from the HMS Ark Royal.
Extract:-
HMS Ark Royal was off Florida at the time of Belize emergency of 1972. Although still over 2.600 miles away, the ship launched two Buccaneer fighter-bombers for a demonstration flight. This proved sufficient to deter a possible Guatemalan invasion. Once again, fixed-wing aircraft carriers proved their value as force of military deterrence. (Photo: FAA Museum)
_______________
Link:- (to view pics - scroll half way downthe page)
http://www.acig.org/artman/publish/article_162.shtml
Says it all me thinks!!!!
Little h
sierra hotel
30-01-2011, 15:48
okay it doesnt float, but there were some notes earlier on about special painted aircraft..... here is one fresh out of the paint shops, really pretty.... VAQ 129 bird, and this just arrived at NAS North Island.... enjoy
terreplein
30-01-2011, 16:09
Both of those schemes look nice. Thanks for the photo.
designeraccd
30-01-2011, 16:19
Here are two more RETRO painted Naval birds.........DFO :D
ivorthediver
30-01-2011, 17:18
No Argument from me harry ...........shame we don't have anything now :mad:
INVINCIBLE
30-01-2011, 18:27
Harry,
Great stuff!
The taxpayer was certainly getting very good ‘Value For Money’. There are quite a few examples where naval aircraft have been able to achieve the desired effect by low roaring passes in the right place at the right time:
Centaur did it with six Sea Vixens over Tabora in January 1964 (I was there). Hermes and Victorious did it over Aden on 17 May 1967, with Buccaneers and Sea Vixens as part of Operation Fate. Then Ark over British Honduras on 26 January 1972. The CVS Ark did it with Sea Harriers in Bosnia on 22 February 1994. (a couple of extracts below from 'Safeguarding the Nation the story of the Modern Royal Navy'). I expect members of the Forum can come up with other examples.
Mitch Hinde
30-01-2011, 19:37
Two of our friends, Ark Royal and Buccaneer; have a 'butchers hook' (look) at this then, to stir up the need for fixed wing carriers... extracts from a site linked below:-
_______________
Extract:-
This time the Royal Navy had a task force with aircraft carrier HMS Ark Royal deployed in the western Atlantic, bound for the Virginia Capes, and carrying Hawker Siddeley S.Mk.1 Buccaneer fighter-bombers of the Naval Air Squadron 809 as well as McDonnell Douglas F-4K Phantom IIs of the NAS.892. Fresh from repairs after a collision with Soviet Kotlin-class destroyer, in the Mediterranean in late 1971, the ship – supported by two supply-vessels, RFA Olmeda and RFA Regent – was ordered to flank speed on 26 January. On the following morning, a Fairey Gannet AEW-aircraft was sent to Bermuda to collect documents relating to the situation in British Honduras, and on 28 January two Buccaneers were sent for a 4.000km round-trip over the colony. Despite the length of their mission and the fact that they had only ten minutes of fuel over the crisis area, the two fighter-bombers – supported by two Buccaneers equipped as tankers on the way out and two on the way in – were enough for the Guatemalans to get the message: if they invaded, they would be facing a powerful air group from the HMS Ark Royal.
Extract:-
HMS Ark Royal was off Florida at the time of Belize emergency of 1972. Although still over 2.600 miles away, the ship launched two Buccaneer fighter-bombers for a demonstration flight. This proved sufficient to deter a possible Guatemalan invasion. Once again, fixed-wing aircraft carriers proved their value as force of military deterrence. (Photo: FAA Museum)
_______________
Link:- (to view pics - scroll half way downthe page)
http://www.acig.org/artman/publish/article_162.shtml
Says it all me thinks!!!!
Little h
Hi Little h
The British Honduras incident is well documented in the book "Phoenix Squadron" by Rowland White. Plenty of political/military background and piccys. Better than fiction.
Mitch Hinde
harry.gibbon
30-01-2011, 20:30
Hi Little h
The British Honduras incident is well documented in the book "Phoenix Squadron" by Rowland White. Plenty of political/military background and piccys. Better than fiction.
Mitch Hinde
Yeh Mitch, it was as a consequence of some exchanges on facebook yesterday about the book between myself and a couple of ex-matelots, one ex (S) branch like myself, that brought me to bring the subject to this thread on the forum.
Little h
Mitch Hinde
30-01-2011, 21:52
Hi Little h
The man also wrote Vulcan 607 about the attack on the Falklands. Involved a far more complicated refuelling plan including tankers refuelling tankers.
Mitch Hinde
harry.gibbon
30-01-2011, 22:37
Hi Little h
The man also wrote Vulcan 607 about the attack on the Falklands. Involved a far more complicated refuelling plan including tankers refuelling tankers.
Mitch Hinde
Hey Mitch, from memory about 21 V bombers in total I think and the majority used mainly in the tanking role. Didn't one have to divert to Uraguay (IIRC) and was 'impounded'/detained for a while.
I have read a couple of accounts of the operation when I was taking books as a member of the Military Book Society and before I gave them all away a couple of years ago:(.
Little h
harry.gibbon
30-01-2011, 23:30
Harry,
Great stuff!
The taxpayer was certainly getting very good ‘Value For Money’. There are quite a few examples where naval aircraft have been able to achieve the desired effect by low roaring passes in the right place at the right time:
Centaur did it with six Sea Vixens over Tabora in January 1964 (I was there). Hermes and Victorious did it over Aden on 17 May 1967, with Buccaneers and Sea Vixens as part of Operation Fate. Then Ark over British Honduras on 26 January 1972. The CVS Ark did it with Sea Harriers in Bosnia on 22 February 1994. (a couple of extracts below from 'Safeguarding the Nation the story of the Modern Royal Navy'). I expect members of the Forum can come up with other examples.
Yep indeed, Operation Vantage 1961 comes to mind, threatened(?) invasion of Kuwait, Bulwark with 42 cdo and escorts sent to Gulf. Bulwark gets alongside in Kuwait first week July, followed by Victorious and her escorts arriving shortly thereafter, to be relieved by Centaur and her escorts 3 x Battle Class from 1st DS in Med (one of which I was on), plus LST Messina and Minesweepers from Med.
Thus seaborne jet air cover becomes available,to supplement RAF a/c from bases ashore.
Little h
brian james
31-01-2011, 00:33
Iam trying a first pic of an FA18 landing on the USS Kittyhawk at sunset....
http://i53.tinypic.com/23r1wnp.jpg
brian james
31-01-2011, 00:38
Imay have used the wrong size ...here is one from my collection of sunset flight ops on the USS Nimitz.......
brian james
01-02-2011, 00:49
Vapour and heat from an FA18 off USS Kittyhawk..........
brian james
01-02-2011, 21:03
A steamy evening on the USS Kittyhawk.......
brian james
02-02-2011, 01:16
An FA18 from the 'Fist Of The Fleet' Squadron traps on the USS Ronald Reagan.........
Commodor Armiger,I don't think the Westland Wyvern lives up to the Scimitar's dismal record but it must come well up the pecking order of dangerous aircraft,with 63 accidents,39 lost and 13 fatalities.What that was as a percentage of those in service I don't know.
Mitch Hinde
02-02-2011, 15:47
Hi All
Whatever happened to the Gloster Javelin? Lovely looking aircraft to my mind.
Mitch Hinde
brian james
02-02-2011, 19:39
G'day Mitch...... I recall in the 60s seeing a Javelin Squadron in Singapore,...what a magnifiicent aircraft they were,...I have quite a large collection of various aircraft on disc,..so when I return from my annual 1 mths leave...which starts today.....I will have a 'rummage round' and see what I can come up with.. The weather here(mid north east coast AUST)is a balmy 35 degrees with a cyclone warning out at the moment so everyone is battening down...
harry.gibbon
04-02-2011, 00:12
Hi All
Whatever happened to the Gloster Javelin? Lovely looking aircraft to my mind.
Mitch Hinde
I also often saw them either as singletons or in force (in formation) in Singapore whilst there 64-66, fantastic sight!
Mitch, since your question asks what happened to them, here is a link to some info regarding survivors:-
_____________
Despite a decent production run (by British standards), and though a respectable number of examples were preserved for a while as gate guards (at RAF stations Acklington, Hartlebury, Innsworth, Leeming, Manston, Stafford, Swanton Morley, Swinderby, Ternhill, West Raynham and Yatesbury), the closure of many stations more often than not led to the Javelin being scrapped (if it had not already been replaced by another type on the gate). As a consequence very few now remain in existence, though thankfully they all seem to have secure futures (though I would not count anything on the gate at an RAF establishment as particularly secure judging by the past record of Javelin gate guards - indeed the very last example of an FAW.2 in existence was scrapped not so long ago, and RAF Stafford upgraded their gate guard to a Harrier GR.3).
_________________
taken from:-
http://www.thunder-and-lightnings.co.uk/javelin/survivors.php
.... where you can also find details of the history/development of the a/c.
Little h
Vegaskip
04-02-2011, 19:08
For those interested in jet a/c, I posted a painting of Sea Hawks and one of an Intruder on Jims Ship Paintings thread.
brian james
09-02-2011, 01:20
An FA-18 Super Hornet from the Argonauts Squadron creates relections on finals...
brian james
09-02-2011, 01:25
Blue Diamonds Squadron FA18 on finals to the USS Ronald Reagan CVN76
brian james
09-02-2011, 01:29
A Kestrels Squadron CAG FA18 on finals...
Thanks Brian great pictures thanks for posting them
brian james
09-02-2011, 22:15
My pleasure Dave...I have an extensive collection of Naval Aircraft Pics!!...Here is an 'oldie'..An A4 Skyhawk at dusk on the USS Coral Sea 1960s.
brian james
09-02-2011, 22:20
An FA18 Super Hornet launches off USS Ronald Reagan CVN77.......
brian james
09-02-2011, 22:25
An F14 Tomcat sits in dusk light on the cat on USS Theodore Roosevelt CVN71............
brian james
09-02-2011, 22:30
A 'Shooter' on the USS Harry S Truman 'gives the go' for an FA18 Super Hornet on a dusk launch..........
brian james
09-02-2011, 22:33
A brilliant Tomcat sunset..................
brian james
09-02-2011, 22:38
A CAG F14 Tomcat on the Cat all 'steamed up' on USS Constellation
brian james
09-02-2011, 22:44
Last one for today...An FA18 'vapourises' the air off USS Abraham Lincoln...
brian james
10-02-2011, 00:34
Dave I am offon leave for the next 3wks.... so here are 4 pics before Ileave....A combination of steam..vapour... air currents...vortices and heat give some great pic results.....
brian james
10-02-2011, 00:36
Night Ops on USS Harry S Truman........
brian james
10-02-2011, 00:39
A CAG FA18 from the 'Ragin Bulls' Squadron is Cat 'prepped' on USS Harry S Truman.....
brian james
10-02-2011, 00:41
A Tomcat launch...........
Many thanks Brian, loved the tomcat shots, a plane that nearly replaced my beloved phantom in my affection!
Especially liked the cag bird pics
designeraccd
20-02-2011, 15:28
Blue Angels celebrating over San Diego...DFO :D
designeraccd
20-02-2011, 15:44
A further 100th Anniversary pic: functional Curtiss seaplane replica taxing on water behind the STENNIS (seen in Blue Angel pic)....DFO :D
Talk about a labor of love: I wonder how long and how much it cost to build the Curtiss from scratch??! Love thoose straight pipes coming out of the engine!
brian james
22-02-2011, 02:54
My pleasure Dave,...I am now home from leave and have had a quick scan of my photo collection (most are now on disc)......Here are a few of my favourite..... The F14 Tomcat CAG Bird from the 'Jolly Rodgers' Squadron on the USS John F Kennedy.....and lastly a real oldie!! F4 Phantom Cag from the USS Enterprise.....I hope you like them .......Regards Brian.........
brian james
22-02-2011, 02:57
A CAG Bird down the cat.............
brian james
22-02-2011, 03:00
The new and the old 2004 USS John F Kennedy..........
brian james
22-02-2011, 03:05
An F4 Phantom CAG Bird from the 'Pukin Dogs' Squadron........
brian james
22-02-2011, 03:16
An FA18 Super Hornet CAG Bird from the 'Fighting Redcocks' Squadron 'traps' on the USS Ronald Reagan CVN 76..............
brian james
22-02-2011, 03:30
An FA18 CAG Bird from the 'Golden Dragons' Squadron 'traps on the USS Nimitz......
astraltrader
22-02-2011, 03:53
Brian thanks for the pictures but unfortunately we now only accept them in the thumbnail mode rather than load them as you have done.
I have been away with the flu for the past 3 weeks and more or else I would have let you know this when you first started posting them.
One of the other moderators should have pointed this out to you so I do apologise for any confusion caused.
It is very easy to load them in the thumbnail mode [just click onto the paperclip shaped icon in the reply box] but it means you will have to upload them directly from your computer rather than from a hosting site such as Photobucket or Tiny pics.
We have adopted this policy purely to prevent photos being removed in the future which leave posts with those horrible little red diagonal crosses instead of pictures!
Dont worry about your existing pictures you have already posted myself or one of the other moderators will change them over to thumbnails when we have a bit of time.
Many thanks.
brian james
22-02-2011, 04:31
A FA18 Hornet CAG Bird from the 'Bounty Hunters' Squadron launches off the USS Abraham Lincoln CVN72..........
brian james
22-02-2011, 04:39
Terry ...Sorry for my "inexperience' in this matter....I hope I have not caused too much trouble for you on this great Forum and will try to 'improve' my posting behaviour....... Regards Brian....PPS I am pleased to hear you are over your "influenza episode"............
astraltrader
22-02-2011, 06:03
No trouble at all Brian. And thanks for your kind comments - I am starting to finally feel much better.
brian james
22-02-2011, 07:04
Terry when I go into the reply box ......for the life of me I cannot see a 'Paperclip' icon anywhere in this box!!!....I must be going bonkers!!!!can you help?........regards Brian...............
Hey Brian Great pics do you have any of VF-116 Aardvaarks anywhere?
astraltrader
22-02-2011, 16:04
Brian - it is the second symbol to the the right of the big letter A at the top row of the reply box[I agree that it is not the best portrayal of a paper clip!!].
brian james
22-02-2011, 22:14
Gday Blaydon.....I will have a 'rummage' through my discs and see what I can come up with!!...... Meanwhile Dave I have some more CAG Bird pics for you.....
brian james
22-02-2011, 22:18
Wildcats CAG Bird
brian james
22-02-2011, 22:19
Rampagers CAG Bird
brian james
22-02-2011, 23:06
cag bird 3rd attempt
brian james
22-02-2011, 23:09
An f4 Phantom CAG Bird USS Ranger 1974....
brian james
22-02-2011, 23:14
A digital camo paint job on the 'Kestrels' Squadron CAG Bird on USS Abraham Lincoln
brian james
22-02-2011, 23:18
A Tomcatcatters CAG Bird on USS Theodore Roosevelt......
brian james
22-02-2011, 23:20
Royal Maces CAG Bird....
brian james
22-02-2011, 23:24
Bounty Hunters CAG Bird
brian james
22-02-2011, 23:27
2 F4 Phantoms with unusual paintjobs
brian james
22-02-2011, 23:32
'Fighting Redcocks' Squadron CAG Bird with digtal camo celebrating 100 years of USN Aviation
brian james
22-02-2011, 23:33
Tomcatters CAG Bird
brian james
22-02-2011, 23:35
One of the final Tomcat launches
brian james
22-02-2011, 23:38
Tomcatters CAG Bird closeup *Note the 'Lantirn' pod on the starboard pylon
brian james
22-02-2011, 23:41
Tomcatters CAG CLOSEUP
brian james
23-02-2011, 04:36
Blaydon ..do you mean the F111 swing wing bomber which was nicknamed the 'Aardvaark or VFA 116 Black Lions Squadron ..known as "The Aardvarks"... who flew the f14 Tomcat and the F4 Phantom either way I have some pics of all three!!....let me know
brian james
23-02-2011, 04:43
An F4 Phantom catches a wire on USS Ranger
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