1st South African Division in North Africa

[jainso31]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1st_Infantry_Division_(South_Africa)

This Division operated continuously in North Africa from Aug. 1940 to Jan .1943.It was engaged in most of the actions during this period, winning much fame.It was disbanded for "Homeland Defence" on 1st Jan. 1943.

jainso31





http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1st_Infantry_Division_(South_Africa)

[Sean Roberts]

H Jainso.Iwas once told by an old SouthAfrican soldier,that Their troops were raised on the understanding that they served ONLY on African soil? This can not be true though as the popped up regularly all over the place in both World Wars.
Perhaps he meant MODERN South African Troops?

[jainso31]

Well Sean,despite their magnificent contribution in North Africa-they were withdrawn for Homeland Defence post the Battle of EL Alamein.AT that time the Japanese were empire building.:(

jainso31

[Brett Hendey]

Sean

It is true that in World War II the South Africans who volunteered for service took an oath to serve only on the African continent, but later after Italy was invaded this restriction was relaxed. Also, many men from the South African Naval Forces were seconded to serve in the Royal Navy and they were present in every theatre that the RN operated.

jainso

I recently wrote the following account for another forum that is unlikely to be frequented by members of this one, so it can do no harm to repeat it here. It concerns the man who becamethe OC of the 1st SA Division early in 1942.

Major-General Dan Pienaar CB DSO & Bar

Dan Pienaar was South Africa’s most charismatic general during World War II. He commanded troops with success in both the Abyssinian and North African campaigns and might have gone on to even greater achievements had he not been killed in an aircraft crash in December 1942. His interest in and commitment to a military career had its origins during the Anglo-Boer War.

When the War broke out, Dan was a six-year old living on a farm in the Wakkerstroom district of the Transvaal. His father and two of his older brothers joined their commando and went off to war. All three ended up in India as prisoners of war. Like so many Boer wives, Mrs Pienaar was left alone with the difficult tasks of both managing the farm and raising the children still with her. For a while the family was helped by a friendly British soldier, who brought them gifts of food and other supplies. He was known as “the tame Englishman”. Eventually, early in 1901, the family was moved to a concentration camp near Pietermaritzburg, where they were to remain until December 1902.

The misery of the camp was aggravated for the Pienaars when Dan’s leg was severely lacerated by an accident with an axe. In his book, Pienaar of Alamein, A M Pollock wrote of the aftermath of the accident as follows:

“Blood-poisoning set in and Dan was taken to the British military hospital at Fort Napier. It was at first feared that his leg would have to be amputated. Several doctors held consultations, and finally Dan’s mother was called in to make the decision. She decided on the more slender chance of her son’s pulling through without amputation. Slowly the leg responded to treatment, but for four long months Dan had to lie in the military hospital. On either side of him and all round him were wounded British “Tommies”. He became their favourite. Far from their own families, these soldiers, in their rough but kindly way, took the small boy to their hearts and lavished upon him an affection they would normally have reserved for their own children. Dan responded, as a child would, and very soon he and these British soldiers were fast friends. That friendship persisted in spite of later misunderstandings and undoubtedly formed the foundation of the deep respect which Major-General Dan Pienaar had for the ordinary British soldier.”

After the War ended, the Pienaars went back to their farm near Wakkerstroom. More hardships followed. The farm was maintained with great difficulty and all hope of a decent education for Dan was lost. His mother had hoped that Dan would have a career in the church, but Dan had already decided his future lay elsewhere. Mrs Pienaar died in 1906, perhaps worn out by the stresses and privations of her life. By 1911, with the farm still in difficulty, Dan decided to leave and fulfill a dream by making a new life for himself in the military.

Pollock continues the story:

“As luck would have it, the Natal Police were calling for recruits and especially for Afrikaans-speaking men from adjoining provinces. Dan’s father was able to scrape together enough money to buy a single railway ticket from Wakkerstroom to Pietermaritzburg, headquarters of the Natal Police; and so off went Dan – with a light heart, high hopes and half a crown in his pocket. This was on November 26, 1911.”

A few days later, and in spite of being underage, Dan dressed in the uniform of a former enemy and he settled into a life in which he excelled. From the Natal Police he went on to serve in what became the Defence Force of the Union of South Africa, whose uniform he wore with pride and honour until the day he died 31 years later.

Dreams can be realised in spite of the most improbable of circumstances.

19/05/2011

Brett

[jainso31]

My grateful thanks to you sharing Pienaar's story with us .I note that after his death in Dec 1942-the 1st South African Infantry Division was Disbanded and went home. I note you say there was South Africans in action in Italy; and on checking up on this-I found the 6th SA Armoured Division was in action on the road to Rome and thereafter.It comprised the 5th SA Armoured Brigadeplus a Brigade of four Lorried SA Infantry-one being the Natal Caribineers.

jainso31

[Nobby_N]

Thanks for this Jainso. I read the Wikipedia link about the 1st SA Infantry with interest. I believe, and it is hinted at in that article, that there was considerable bad feeling between the Australians and the South Africans and it was all connected with what had happened in Tobruk. The Aussies had held out for so long and the South Africans took over and surrendered. That's the story as I heard it. The Wikipedia article makes it clear that they were overwhelmed by superior forces and, as so often is the case (think Afghanistan) they didn't have the appropriate equipment to fight back effectively. The story goes on that this rankled with the Aussies so much that when they were returning to Australia their troop ship called at Capetown and the Aussies went ashore and trashed the place, big time -. Their revenge for Tobruk grievances. All was hushed up I believe, and these things grow in the telling from the mere breaking up of a couple of bars to a major riot.

I heard about this from a work colleague who had worked in South Africa in the 1950s, which would have been within recent memory of events.

Am I right? Does anyone know any more about this?

Nobby_N

[jainso31]

Nobby I am aware of the facts-1)the Australians held Tobruk for some time and 2)handed over to the South Africans and others who were besieged; and outnumbered in every respect; and ultimately had to surrender.I shall research the "business" of bad feeling.:(

jainso31

[jainso31]

Nobby perhaps the detail in the link will better describe what really hapened
at the Fall of Tobruk:cool:

jainso31



http://www.battlefront.com/community/archive/index.php/t-45504.html

[Nobby_N]

Thanks again Jainso. That was very useful and covered a lot. It didn't cover the business of the Aussies beating up Cape Town, or Durban, wherever it was, about which I was curious. You have these scraps of long remembered conversations in the back of your mind and you think: is there any truth in it?

The last post in that link and a quote from a previous does give the general atmosphere and background so it is all very likely, but could still be myth.

Nobby_N
Quote follows:

Mr Furious10-25-2003, 03:58 PM
Originally posted by Determinant:
<SNIP>

Every cloud does have a silver lining though. The whole sad episode has given us the wonderful story told by Barrie Pitt of the greatest bar fight in the Middle East: a pub in Cairo is packed with heavily drinking Australians. Some South Africans walk in. Everything goes quiet. A chair scrapes as a Digger stands up. 'Hello mate,' he says 'Have a seat, I'll buy you a beer. You look done-in. Have you run all the way from Tobruk?' Thus ensued a fight worthy of a Hollywood Western. Pitt proudly drops his authorial objectivity to record that he suffered a split lip and several broken ribs in that fight.

As the Duke of Wellington observed: 'God knows what they do to the enemy but they terrify me'.
Yes us Aussies are renowned for pub fights during WW2 the greatest being The Battle of Melbourne, a fight that started between US Servicemen and Australian Soldiers on leave at Young& Jacksons pub here in Melbourne, Victoria. The fight lasted 3 days, people would go home, go to sleep and come back for a bit of a fight, the cops couldn't break it up, the commanding officers couldn't control their men (and were usually involved thick in the fighting anyway)and i don't think there were any resultant deaths either. No one was court-marshalled and it was estimated taht at any one time up to 500 men were fighting in the pub and on the streets... trying to get into the pub.

I've also read a lot about the AIF's involvement in the middle east and in particular Tobruk. Throughout these books the authors made it clear that "no man's land" between Aussie and German lines ie the minefield and immediate surrounds was really held by the Aussies who maintained continual patrols around the minefields and attacked and ambusehed the opposition armies as much aspossible, particularly the Italian armies who they found broke easier then the Afrika Korps, breaking the backs of a lot of attacks, that really should of broken through. Of course any war reporting from the personal view is probably biased in some fashion, so i'm not sure how accurate the reporting is.

I'll have to find these books now and read up on them again.

[jainso31]

Nobby
I think your quote about the bar fight in Cairo, started by the Aussies taunting the South Africans "have you run all the way from Tobruk-you must be tired" ultimately involviing 500 men was a riotous affray.If I find a postscript to this; I will post it.:D;):eek:

jainso31

[jainso31]

Nobby-this link alludes tot he brawl in a Cairo bar.

jainso31:eek:



http://www.google.co.uk/#hl=en&xhr=t&q=Bar+brawl+in+Cairo+involving+Aussie+and+S+Africa n+soldiers&cp=58&pf=p&sclient=psy&source=hp&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=Bar+brawl+in+Cairo+involving+Aussie+and+S+Afric an+soldiers&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&fp=8a26adf51df2dc3a